Can someone clarify the rules on this?

[cornej1]

Hello Everyone,
I'm new to the forum and joined specifically to see if someone could clarify something for me that's driving me nuts. First, I played football through college, am an avid fan, coached youth football for many years, etc. I generally understand the rules. My son plays on a D3 college team here in the Midwest. At his game on Saturday there was a 3rd and 15 play where the refs called an ineligible receiver downfield on the offense and then called pass interference on the defense. After a little discussion they picked up the pass interference flag and ruled the pass un-catchable. Our coach then declines the ineligible receiver penalty to bring up 4th and 20, right? I believe the ref actually announced it that way, but we then had another long discussion amongst the refs and ultimately re-played 3rd down. I actually saw the down marker guy flip to 4th down and then had to flip it back to 3rd. How does that scenario not bring up 4th down?

Thanks.

Jason

[Welpe]

Hi Jason, welcome to the forum. Thanks for your question.

The penalty for ineligible receiver down field only specifies 5 yards from the previous spot, it does not include a loss of down. When the penalty for a live ball foul is accepted, the down will be replayed unless the penalty specifies a loss of down (intentional grounding for example).

In this case either the penalty can be accepted and it will be 3rd and 20 or the penalty can be declined and it'll be 4th and 15.

[cornej1]

Right, I get that but somewhere there is some weirdness to this one. The ineligible receiver penalty was declined which should have brought up 4th and 20, which the ref announced but then conferred at length with the other officials and went over to talk to both coaches (this process took about 10 minutes). At the end of all of that we re-played 3rd and 15. No idea why.

thanks.

Jason

[Sturno]

If you're positive it was 3rd down on the play in question, then it's likely:

- they didn't pick one up and there was off-setting penalties that made it a replay of 3rd down (3rd & 15 again).

OR

- your coach didn't decline it as you thought and with the accepted penalty walk off from previous spot that gave the offense 3rd down over again, now at 3rd and 20. If they declined the penalty, it would've been 4th and 15, not 4th and 20....unless I'm missing something.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by cornej1

Right, I get that but somewhere there is some weirdness to this one. The ineligible receiver penalty was declined which should have brought up 4th and 20, which the ref announced but then conferred at length with the other officials and went over to talk to both coaches (this process took about 10 minutes). At the end of all of that we re-played 3rd and 15. No idea why.

thanks.

Jason

What happened on the play? You didn't specify but my assumption was an incomplete pass. If it was then it should have been 4th and 15 if the penalty was declined. If it was accepted it should have been 3rd and 20.

If the down was replayed 3rd and 15 then it sounds like the penalties were offset and the down was replayed.

Or somebody messed something up.

Without more info, it's really hard to say for sure.

[HLin NC]

Check to see if your college's athletic web site posts the official stats and play by play sheet. It should be in there if they do.