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-   -   Snap before ready to play (https://forum.officiating.com/football/96222-snap-before-ready-play.html)

Suudy Mon Oct 07, 2013 03:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn (Post 906922)
Does anyone have a copy (or link to) the Waynesburg / Fordham game in 1939 - we could look and see.
Well, found some video of Pitt/Fordham from 1937.

Pitt at Fordham Football 1937 Polo Grounds (Part One) - YouTube

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="//www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/rAhIoVhW93Y" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Edit: Or perhaps better yet, Princeton/Yale from 1910. Watch about 30 seconds into the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcfoKTjHhIA

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="//www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/NcfoKTjHhIA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Looks like the official in the backfield spots the ball (and winds the clock).

MD Longhorn Mon Oct 07, 2013 04:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 906923)
There is still a brief time where the U has to back off and when I was the WH on my crew, I gave the U time to get into a safe place. Sometimes teams do not listen and snap the ball anyway. Sometimes players just do not listen to our warnings to "not snap the ball."

Peace
Once the umpire backs off, they can snap it. Especially when they are time crunched.

JRutledge Mon Oct 07, 2013 05:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn (Post 906930)
Once the umpire backs off, they can snap it. Especially when they are time crunched.
Well not how it is taught to do here. The RFP is just that, the RFP. I the officials are not ready, we do not blow the whistle in. And that is why we often are talking to the QB and snapper to wait until we have blown the whistle. Not much different from what we do on a kick off. Just because we start going off the field does not mean it is OK to kick the football.

Peace

bisonlj Mon Oct 07, 2013 09:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 906934)
Well not how it is taught to do here. The RFP is just that, the RFP. I the officials are not ready, we do not blow the whistle in. And that is why we often are talking to the QB and snapper to wait until we have blown the whistle. Not much different from what we do on a kick off. Just because we start going off the field does not mean it is OK to kick the football.

Peace
He's in Texas so he's talking NCAA rule. With the 40-second play clock on many downs, the ball is ready for play when the ball is spotted and the U moves away. I do ask that they give me a second to get out, but by rule as soon as I step away they can snap it.

MD Longhorn Tue Oct 08, 2013 08:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 906934)
Well not how it is taught to do here. The RFP is just that, the RFP. I the officials are not ready, we do not blow the whistle in. And that is why we often are talking to the QB and snapper to wait until we have blown the whistle. Not much different from what we do on a kick off. Just because we start going off the field does not mean it is OK to kick the football.

Peace
We're talking about the NCAA - there is no RFP.

CT1 Tue Oct 08, 2013 09:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suudy (Post 906927)
Or perhaps better yet, Princeton/Yale from 1910. Watch about 30 seconds into the video.
Interesting way to mark a field in the Chicago-Michigan clip.

bob jenkins Tue Oct 08, 2013 09:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by CT1 (Post 906969)
Interesting way to mark a field in the Chicago-Michigan clip.
That's why they call it a "gridiron"

Robert Goodman Tue Oct 08, 2013 02:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 906972)
That's why they call it a "gridiron"
No, it was called that before the lengthwise lines were added -- actually even before the crosswise lines were put down. When it was proposed to the rules committee for the 1882 season that lines be added every 5 yards to judge the line to gain, I forgot who said it would look like a gridiron. The lengthwise lines came in decades later with some rules restricting the advance of the ball by run or pass. The field could use them again, to judge the FBZ by.

They could've eliminated half the yard lines in 1912 when the distance to gain was increased to 10 yds., but they haven't. Heck, a lot of fields were still marked with an X at the center of the 40 yd. lines for many decades after the kickoff was no longer required to be from its center.

BktBallRef Tue Oct 08, 2013 08:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Goodman (Post 907006)
No, it was called that before the lengthwise lines were added -- actually even before the crosswise lines were put down. When it was proposed to the rules committee for the 1882 season that lines be added every 5 yards to judge the line to gain, I forgot who said it would look like a gridiron. The lengthwise lines came in decades later with some rules restricting the advance of the ball by run or pass. The field could use them again, to judge the FBZ by.

They could've eliminated half the yard lines in 1912 when the distance to gain was increased to 10 yds., but they haven't. Heck, a lot of fields were still marked with an X at the center of the 40 yd. lines for many decades after the kickoff was no longer required to be from its center.
Bob, Robert would know. It was there in 1882. :D

CT1 Wed Oct 09, 2013 06:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Goodman (Post 907006)
Heck, a lot of fields were still marked with an X at the center of the 40 yd. lines for many decades after the kickoff was no longer required to be from its center.
Whadda mean, "were"? A majority of the fields I call on still have the X.

parepat Thu Oct 10, 2013 09:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Goodman (Post 906865)
And according to what was written in a thread here about a week ago, in NCAA, you've got a real problem, since they're not required to "chop", whistle, or otherwise signal the RFP if the 40-sec. rule is in effect. Team A has no notice other than looking at the chain crew of whether they're allowed to snap the ball or not.
Not true in this scenario. You would have a ready for play due to the first down.

Bob M. Wed Oct 16, 2013 03:27pm
REPLY: I was at an inter-conference game (Big-10 vs. ACC) earlier this season. A Big-12 crew was officiating. I was surprised to see the R spot the ball several times. I couldn't figure out the rhyme or reason for him to spot it.

MD Longhorn Wed Oct 16, 2013 03:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob M. (Post 907778)
REPLY: I was at an inter-conference game (Big-10 vs. ACC) earlier this season. A Big-12 crew was officiating. I was surprised to see the R spot the ball several times. I couldn't figure out the rhyme or reason for him to spot it.
Big 12 crew ... were they using the "A" official?

Could it be sweeps to the U's side, perhaps U was trailing, and R was simply closer?

parepat Wed Oct 16, 2013 04:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob M. (Post 907778)
REPLY: I was at an inter-conference game (Big-10 vs. ACC) earlier this season. A Big-12 crew was officiating. I was surprised to see the R spot the ball several times. I couldn't figure out the rhyme or reason for him to spot it.
Funny you mentioned this. I worked a spring game and got dinged for not spotting the ball enough at the R. The U on my normal crew would hit me if I tried to spot more. Is this a trend?

ajmc Thu Oct 17, 2013 01:12pm
Sometimes a cooperative player may toss the dead ball to a Referee who happens to be closest, or even standing on, what proves to be the subsequent spot, does it really make sense for him to re-toss the ball to the umpire so he can spot the ball where the Referee is standing?

"no harm, no foul" can apply to things other than contact between players.


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