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Fri Sep 08, 2000, 11:59am
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No rulebook handy, so need some help on a couple of penalty enforcements...(NF please). I apologize for the length...
Play 1 A 1/10 on the B10. A's pass is intercepted in the end zone where the player is tackled. After the interception and before the tackle, B55 clips at the B2. Play 2 A 1/10 on the 50. B intercepts and returns the ball back to the 50. During the runback, B55 clips at the B20. In our meeting the other night we discussed play 1. We decided that the ruling was B's ball 1/10 from the B10. Reason: The final result of the play was a touchback and regarding plays that result in a touchback, penalties are enforced from the succeeding spot. Since the penalty was marked off from the B20, that is how we got to the 10. We did not enforce from the B2, as in the all-but-one principal, because the all-but-one principle only applies to fouls by the offense (Penalty enforcement immediately following Rule 10). Well, if this is the case, then play 2 would also be enforced from the succeeding spot. Because of the all but one. To further complicate matters, the offense remains the offense and the defense remains the defense until the next ready for play (Rule 2, Definitions) so we can't say that the defense becomes the offense because of a change of possession. Is there a exception or did we miss something. We became very focused on the touchback exception and I am afraid we may have mislead some people. This is really weird because we have always enforced a clip as in Play 2 from the spot of the foul. Thanks for your input, Erick 
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Fri Sep 08, 2000, 11:35pm
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quote: Play #1, as you said, is enforced from the succeeding spot, 10-4-4d. But since the spot of the foul is behind the succeeding spot, the penalty is from the 2, half the distance, 1st & 10 from the 1. Whoever said that the all but one principle does not apply to the defense is sadly mistaken. A foul by the defense behind or beyond the basic spot or a foul by the offense beyond the basic spot will be enforced from the basic spot, hence, ALL. A foul by the offense behind the basic spot will be enforced from the spot of the foul, hence, the ONE. quote: Sorry , you're mistaken. The all but one does apply. Since the team with the ball fouled behind the run, the penalty is enforced from the spot of the foul. What if B had scored a TD? Using your theory, where would you have spotted the ball? See? It doesn't work. You're confusing the offense and defense sitch. If there is a change of possession, the defense is now the offense. The offense is the team which is in possession of the ball. The opponent is the defense. A is the team which puts the ball in play. The opponent is B. Re-read 2-42. It sounds like you guys need a good clinic leader to help you out with some of these things. Good luck to you! [This message has been edited by BktBallRef (edited September 10, 2000).]
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Sat Sep 09, 2000, 04:37pm
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quote: I think you're a little confused on the rule when the final result is a touchback. I don't believe it says that when the final result is a touchback the penalty is enforced from the succeeding spot. I believe it says that when the final result is a touchback the succeeding spot is the basic spot. There is a difference between the BASIC spot and the spot of enforcement. This simply means you use the 20-yd line to determine the spot of enforcement rather than the end of the run since the end of the run was in the endzone. The all-but-one principle still applies here since the team w/ the ball is the one committing the foul. Since the foul occurred behind the basic spot by the team in possession it is enforced from the spot of the foul. Therefore it is B's ball at the 1-yd line.
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Sun Sep 10, 2000, 11:06pm
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by linejudge:
Well, if this is the case, then play 2 would also be enforced from the succeeding spot. Because of the all but one. To further complicate matters, the offense remains the offense and the defense remains the defense until the next ready for play (Rule 2, Definitions) so we can't say that the defense becomes the offense because of a change of possession. This is a basic misconception on your part. The offense is the team which is in possession of the ball, the defense is the opponent (2-42-1). In spite of what you read in 2-42-4, when there is a change of team possession the defense becomes the offense and the offense becomes the defense. This concept is essential for proper penalty enforcement under the all-but-one principle. What 2-42-4 means by saying that "Team designations are retained ..." is that Team A is always Team A throughout the down, Team B is Team B throughout the down, Team K stays Team K even after the kick is caught and Team R is designated as Team R. So, in your play, when the ball was snapped, A was the offense. When B intercepted in the end zone, B became the offense. When his teammate fouled at the two, it was a foul by B, but it was also a foul by the offense. The basic spot, because the interception resulted in a touchback, is the twenty yardline so this foul by B at the two becomes a foul by the offense behind the basic spot for enforcement purposes under the all-but-one principle. I hope this helps your understanding of the all-but-one concept.
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