Roughing the kicker....

[JMUplayer]

I was actually doing radio and had never seen this play before. I asked another official later in the week and he said the guys in stripes got it right. The opposing coach wasn't happy.

High School
Point after attempt:

Team A is kicking.
Ball is snapped.... it's high but the holder rises up and corrals it and sets it down. Team B player who is rushing from the edge comes and and tackles the kicker before the ball is kicked. Team B 2/3/4 tackles the holder once the kicker gets whacked.

Result... Personal Foul roughing the kicker and the get to kick again.

Why Team B went straight after the kicker instead of the ball i have no idea.

[Welpe]

A kicker is not a kicker by definition until he kicks the ball so you can't have roughing in this situation. That said, if he doesn't possess the ball, there could be a personal foul for unecessary roughness but I would want to see the play to say whether or not that was the case.

[JMUplayer]

Should have added i do believe the kicker took at least one step towards the ball intending to kick it but never reached the ball before being whacked. I don't know if that makes a difference.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by JMUplayer

Should have added i do believe the kicker took at least one step towards the ball intending to kick it but never reached the ball before being whacked. I don't know if that makes a difference.

It makes a huge difference. You have to touch the ball with your leg or lower leg to be considered a kicker. Then again that was stated previously so that is why roughing the kicker would not be appropriate based on your description. It matters because if you call a RTK or a personal foul you have a difference between an automatic first down and 15 yards and depending on the down and distance the replaying the same down.

Peace

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by JMUplayer

Should have added i do believe the kicker took at least one step towards the ball intending to kick it but never reached the ball before being whacked. I don't know if that makes a difference.

It does not. If he was tackled before kicking, it cannot by rule be roughing the kicker. Could be a PF, or holding, but not roughing.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by JMUplayer

Should have added i do believe the kicker took at least one step towards the ball intending to kick it but never reached the ball before being whacked. I don't know if that makes a difference.

It doesn't. I guess the question is... was the contact on the kicker such that one would call it USC had the contact been on, say, a WR or OL.

If no, then no - K is just a random player until he actually makes contact between ball and foot, and gets no special protection.

To add, though ... this must have been the slowest PAT attempt ever.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

It doesn't. I guess the question is... was the contact on the kicker such that one would call it USC had the contact been on, say, a WR or OL.

If no, then no - K is just a random player until he actually makes contact between ball and foot, and gets no special protection.

To add, though ... this must have been the slowest PAT attempt ever.

Well, it's not a USC since it's contact related.

But if K was tackled, it's probably holding.

[Daryl H. Long]

Holding is the right call: NF Rule 9-2-3c. (Assmes contact not excessive or flagrant to warrant Personal Foul)

I would consider this a running play so enforcement would be from the end of the run (basic spot), penalize 1/2 distance and replay the Try.

I negate loose ball play because no loose ball ever was attempted. I interpret NF 10-3-1 Note to mean that the run (by holder in this play) MUST be followed by legal or illegal kick, legal forward pass, backward pass, or fumble for the run to be classified as part of the running play. This play did not have that therefore a running play.

[wisref2]

There was no kick, so you can't have roughing the kicker.

And how can you have roughing the holder? There was no kick - so they essentially tackled the ball carrier.

Would have to see it, of course, but it appears that this was a legal play. The only call you make is to another crew to say "You should have seen our play tonight!"