PI mechanics question, 4-man crew

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by jTheUmp

And at least 4 posters (not counting me) have said that it would be part of his area in a 4-man mechanic.


A couple of points here.
1) It's not a crutch, it's the truth. More officials = better coverage. Why do you think NCAA and NFL (and some FED) use seven officials for football?

Heck, in the preseason this year the NFL experimented with adding an 8th official to improve coverage, and I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they added an 8th official permanently in a few years.

Around here, almost all non-varsity games use three officials. The Junior High game I'll be working this afternoon has 2 officials. Do you honestly think we'll be able to make any holding calls on the interior linemen today when we have one official on each sideline?

2) Do a search of the basketball forum and you'll find plenty of threads that talk about the advantages of having three whistle mechanics as opposed to two whistle mechanics. You'll find the same thing in the baseball and softball forums.



I have this happen on an non-trivial amount of single-umpire baseball games that I've worked:
"What do you mean he's out trying to steal second? He slid around the tag!"
"Coach, from my angle, he was out. If you want to have someone with a better angle making the call, pay for a second umpire"
"..... (walks back to the dugout)"

I know all of this. I know it makes for a better game to have three officials in baseball or basketball, but I would never tell that to a coach during a game. I know what you guys are saying. There are coverage gaps and compromises in 2-man baseball and basketball just like in 4-man football, but none of us should actually tell a coach to "hire another official", since 99.9% of the time the coach has nothing to do with how many officials are on the field.

The original play in question just felt a lot like a Lead in basketball calling a hand check on the point guard right in front of the Trail at the top of the key. I realize that I don't know all there is to know about football mechanics, but I have done enough basketball and baseball to know when it appears that someone is reaching for a call that they should probably let a partner take.

From everyone's responses, it sounded like the U can throw a PI flag, which is fine. On this particular play though, it just appeared to me that he didn't see the whole play, was straightlined, and guessed a little. It's over though.

I'm not going to keep arguing with you guys. I understand your side, I just disagreed with the call and still do, but there's nothing that can be done about it now. Thanks again for the replies.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by zm1283

I know all of this. I know it makes for a better game to have three officials in baseball or basketball, but I would never tell that to a coach during a game. I know what you guys are saying. There are coverage gaps and compromises in 2-man baseball and basketball just like in 4-man football, but none of us should actually tell a coach to "hire another official", since 99.9% of the time the coach has nothing to do with how many officials are on the field.

I do not recall this being said to a coach. That being said if a coach was being unreasonable I have and will say this to a coach. I know I have worked 1 man games in basketball and baseball and had coaches cannot believe I missed a play while having to do the job of multiple officials on the field/court.

Originally Posted by zm1283

The original play in question just felt a lot like a Lead in basketball calling a hand check on the point guard right in front of the Trail at the top of the key. I realize that I don't know all there is to know about football mechanics, but I have done enough basketball and baseball to know when it appears that someone is reaching for a call that they should probably let a partner take.

Well you asked can this be called in that situation? I can be called in that situation as you have no BJ and the wings often do not see things in the middle of the field very well. Even in 5 man it is about angles and calling what you see. Even in basketball depending on the situation there would be a call from the Lead at the top of the key by the lead. Heck the lead has to call out of bounds calls on their line all the way up the court, and they are almost never just focused on those plays.

Originally Posted by zm1283

From everyone's responses, it sounded like the U can throw a PI flag, which is fine. On this particular play though, it just appeared to me that he didn't see the whole play, was straightlined, and guessed a little. It's over though.

Well I was not there and neither was anyone else here. I have no idea what the umpire should have seen or should not have called. I just know that in 4 man on a football field, the U has more responsibilities in the middle of the field that is needed because you have less than 5. In a 5 man system they would not be likely to call this as they deal with mostly line plays, but again they can call that too under the right situation too. Again the most ideal situation is 7 man and we can focus on one or two players in those systems so it makes it easier to limit your focus.

Originally Posted by zm1283

I'm not going to keep arguing with you guys. I understand your side, I just disagreed with the call and still do, but there's nothing that can be done about it now. Thanks again for the replies.

Well why did you come here anyway without video or even bring up the issue. You make it sound like we saw the call. We are just telling you what the U/BJ can or cannot do.

Peace