Possession?

[bkdow]

ok, this has happened to me twice in back to back JV games and I need some clarification. Then, as we like to do on this site, I'll add a "what if" to confuse the matter and let the pundants argue (play nice!).

The ball is fumbled and the offensive player lands on the ball in the open field. He is sitting on it as if he were a chicken on her eggs. The ball can hardly be seen because his legs, feet, and rear are almost completely wrapped around it. He is there a full second or more without anyone touching him. Is this possession?

The what if is this: If a receiver is in the end zone and the ball is batted in the air. He falls down and catches it between his feet. (almost had this happen once but luckily it fell to the ground). Would you rule a touchdown?

The bottom line is this, can a player "possess" the ball and not have his hands on it?

[RadioBlue]

SECTION 34 POSSESSION
ART. 1 . . . A ball in player possession is a live ball held or controlled by a player
after it has been handed or snapped to him, or after he has caught or recovered it.

SECTION 4 CATCH
ART. 1 . . . A catch is the act of establishing player possession of a live ball
which is in flight, and first contacting the ground inbounds or being contacted by
an opponent in such a way that he is prevented from returning to the ground
inbounds while maintaining possession of the ball.

The answer to your bottom line is, "Yes, if you judge it so." Player possession = control. Catch = player possession in bounds.

[Canned Heat]

Originally Posted by RadioBlue

The answer to your bottom line is, "Yes, if you judge it so." Player possession = control. Catch = player possession in bounds.

Well put.

If he's clearly on top of it and in control of it...yes. This should be blown quickly to avoid a pile on...and other than waiting that split second to confirm it's under that player's control, you should hit the whistle as the ball is recovered and the player is obviously down....unless you're referring to Professional rules.

Yes, in the second play....after confirming that it's not moving and/or has not touched the ground. I can't imagine the player not sitting up an/or reaching with his hands to gain better control of the ball, in that case.

I've had several instances of player possession with the ball between legs or knees during recovery of fumbles or loose balls on a kick-off. Usually at the lower levels.

[bkdow]

Thank you. That's how I rulled it for the same reasons...didn't want the poor kid getting decapitated. Thanks for the input!

[jTheUmp]

Originally Posted by bkdow

The bottom line is this, can a player "possess" the ball and not have his hands on it?

Yes.

Back in my semi-pro playing days (using NFL rules, IIRC), we had a game against an unfamiliar out-of-state opponent. One of their starting safties (and occasional WR) had no hands, quite literally; his arms ended just below the elbow.

Despite that apparent limitation, he still managed to catch a pass late in the game.

[bkdow]

That's so cool!!