Shot gun center

[Murd]

7 yrd snap the D still can't hit the center until he raises his head?

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by Murd

7 yrd snap the D still can't hit the center until he raises his head?

False.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by Murd

7 yrd snap the D still can't hit the center until he raises his head?

You might want to reference the actual rule (NF: 9.4.6) and 4 Case Book plays regarding this rule. They pretty well explain what is prohibited, and never mention anything about anyone lifting their head.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Murd

7 yrd snap the D still can't hit the center until he raises his head?

He is provided protection but it has nothing to do with whether he lifts his head or not. The defense is prevented from charging directly into him until has snapped the ball and had an opportunity to protect himself.

[Murd]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

He is provided protection but it has nothing to do with whether he lifts his head or not. The defense is prevented from charging directly into him until has snapped the ball and had an opportunity to protect himself.

what would you consider "an opportunity to protect himself " ?
'

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Murd

what would you consider "an opportunity to protect himself " ?
'

That is what you get paid the big bucks to judge.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Murd

what would you consider "an opportunity to protect himself " ?
'

Once the ball is gone and he is under control.

The reason the rule was put in place was because there was a time when defenders would just head hunt the snapper without a regard of other actions in the game. As long as he has the opportunity to pull up his head (snapper), then he can protect himself.

Peace

[Murd]

Originally Posted by Welpe

That is what you get paid the big bucks to judge.

not me, I'm a coach. This is the best forum to come to when I need a straight answer...

[Murd]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Once the ball is gone and he is under control.

The reason the rule was put in place was because there was a time when defenders would just head hunt the snapper without a regard of other actions in the game. As long as he has the opportunity to pull up his head (snapper), then he can protect himself.

Peace

so I was right in my original post?

[parepat]

Coach:

I think it would be fair to say that a snapper is protected while his head is down so long as he has not had the oppurtunity to raise it up and protect himself. A snapper can not lengthen the period of protection by keeping his head down for an extended period of time.

Also, for teaching purposes, his gaps are still subject to charge without a call.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by Murd

so I was right in my original post?

I don't think so, it sounds like you are looking for a "one size fits all" answer, which rarely exists in the game of football. The rule is pretty simple and straightforward the way it's written. (NF: 9.4.6) "Roughing the snapper. A defensive player shall not charge directly into the snapper when the offensive team is in a scrimmage-kick formation.".

Case Book 9.4.6.situation A, goes on to explain further, " The snapper's protection does not include simultaneous contact with another A player, nor does it take away the center-guard gap from B. The roughing prohibition is only for a direct charge into the snapper.", and cites NF: 2.32.14 as a reference.

2.32.14, which describes who a snapper is, advises, "In a scrimmage-kick formation, the snapper remains a snapper until he has had a reasonable opportunity to regain his balance and protect himself or until he blocks or moves to otherwise participate in the play." As is always the case, judging what is reasonable rests with the covering official, alone.

This added level of protection only exists when the offense is in a scrimmage-kick formation, which NF:2.14.2 defines as, "A SKF is a formation with at least one player 7 yards or more behind the NZ and in position to receive the long snap. No player may be in position to receive a hand-to-hand snap from between the snapper's legs. "

[Mike L]

Originally Posted by Murd

not me, I'm a coach. This is the best forum to come to when I need a straight answer...

The purpose of the rule is to prevent injury to a player in a defenseless position. So, generally that means the snapper is going to get a reasonable amount of time to get his head up and protect himself. But he can't stay there forever or even move around in the expectation of buying the call.
And, like parepat said, the gaps between center and guard are open to the defense. For roughing, the contact has to be directly into the snapper. And that is probably where we as officials get most of the complaints about our non-call because most people think the snapper is protected from any contact which is not the rule.

[Mike L]

Originally Posted by Murd

not me, I'm a coach. This is the best forum to come to when I need a straight answer...

The purpose of the rule is to prevent injury to a player in a defenseless position. So, generally that means the snapper is going to get a reasonable amount of time to get his head up and protect himself. But he can't stay there forever or even move around in the expectation of buying the call.
And, like parepat said, the gaps between center and guard are open to the defense. For roughing, the contact has to be directly into the snapper. And that is probably where we as officials get most of the complaints about our non-call because most people think the snapper is protected from any contact which is not the rule.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by Murd

7 yrd snap the D still can't hit the center until he raises his head?

When the offense is in scrimmage kick formation the defense is prohibited from taking a direct charge into the snapper until he has had a chance to gain his balance and protect himself. There are some coaches who mistakenly believe that if they teach their snapper to keep his head down after snapping the ball it is illegal to hit him. This is false.

If the defender tries to shoot the gap between the snapper and the guard there will undoubtedly be contact with the snapper. This action is legal.

[Murd]

thanks for the replys. I was one who believed if a defender fills the gap he couldn't make contact with the center and also if the center kept his head down after the snap he couldn't be hit. I guess after 30 yrs of coaching I'm not as smart as I thought....LOL