Mike Carey

[Blue37]

Originally Posted by jaybird

Note the portion in the rule that says "...in an emergency...". In the Super Bowl (if this rule even applied) or in most all NFHS games there is not an emergency. The game may be a blow out or a team has conceded but the game clock should expire before it is considered completed. We do not start a HS game with 11:59 on the clock, so let's play the entire prescribed time unless it truly is an emergency or a state has a game ending procedure.

If you will notice, the sentence that mentions terminating the contest does not contain the words "in an emergency".

[OverAndBack]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

The TV clock and the actual clock are not always in sync. And if you pay really close attention, you will see time be corrected when they come back to the TV clock because it is not accurate with the stadium clock.

Peace

End of the third quarter, in fact (IIRC), the TV clock didn't run until after the play was over. There were something like 6 seconds left when the last play started, and the TV clock didn't run, and then it did after the play was over.

But, as was mentioned, that clock isn't official. It doesn't matter what that clock does, except that it tends to confuse the home viewer, who thinks that it's the Word of the Lord.

[ace]

can someone explain why the clock was continuing to run while a crew member ran up to carey in the 4th? quarter?

[BigGref]

I agree with the common interpretation/enforcement here. Unless the player is still in the middle of the field and within a step or two I usually let it go. I think that this situation is just that case, the player was only a step and half away. They should not be able to review situations like this, leave to official's discretion. And I'm a colts fan and they do it all the time.

Originally Posted by HossHumard

Once question for my 'murrican brothers about the "Too Many Men" (Illegal Sub.) though.
... Do you guys really nail teams if they're within a half second of a guy touching his sidelines? Is it the same with US Amateur as it is with the NFL? How on earth do you make that call if so?

Thx

[Rich]

Maybe I'm the contrarian here, but I tell my wings to make sure the guy gets off or they should flag it.

[OverAndBack]

At the NFL level, I'm thinking, yeah, they should.

But at the high school level, if I'm a wing and the guy's even with me and busting his *** to get off at the snap, I don't think I'm calling it. If I cheat in because it's a lower-level game and the field seems really wide for the kids playing and the play is on the far hash, as long as he gets behind me, he's fine.

Of course, that's just me and the guys I've worked with in the past. That's not to say that's the best way, just a way they (and I) are comfortable with.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by ace

can someone explain why the clock was continuing to run while a crew member ran up to carey in the 4th? quarter?

The clock at the top of your screen was NOT the official clock.

As such, it routinely started and stopped at the wrong time and was constantly being reset.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by OverAndBack

At the NFL level, I'm thinking, yeah, they should.

But at the high school level, if I'm a wing and the guy's even with me and busting his *** to get off at the snap, I don't think I'm calling it. If I cheat in because it's a lower-level game and the field seems really wide for the kids playing and the play is on the far hash, as long as he gets behind me, he's fine.

Of course, that's just me and the guys I've worked with in the past. That's not to say that's the best way, just a way they (and I) are comfortable with.

I get films of my crew working every year. I remind my crew to count the players and make sure they are giving the visible signal on each play for 2 reasons - one is so we are communicating with each other well and the other is so it can be seen on the video.

Maybe in a freshman game I feel we could get away with this, but on Friday night there are a few cameras taping the game and both coaching staffs will be watching later. I'll be darned if I'm going to let something like this go only to have it show up on the film later. You cannot possibly argue with the flag with the player still on the field.

I'm happy to let crews do whatever they like here - I'm just telling you how my crew handles it.

[OverAndBack]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I get films of my crew working every year. I remind my crew to count the players and make sure they are giving the visible signal on each play for 2 reasons - one is so we are communicating with each other well and the other is so it can be seen on the video.

I learned that early on, and it's a good point. You never know who is watching. Both of those are good reasons to signal.

Maybe in a freshman game I feel we could get away with this, but on Friday night there are a few cameras taping the game and both coaching staffs will be watching later. I'll be darned if I'm going to let something like this go only to have it show up on the film later. You cannot possibly argue with the flag with the player still on the field.

Letter of the rule vs. spirit of the rule.

But, I guess if you go by the letter, you'll always be consistent. Fair enough.

I'm happy to let crews do whatever they like here - I'm just telling you how my crew handles it.

Cool.

As for Mike Carey, I thought he handled himself very well the whole game. I don't know why I hadn't noticed that little arm twirl he does when he signals the down after the administration of a penalty before.

[Bob M.]

Originally Posted by BigGref

....They should not be able to review situations like this, leave to official's discretion. And I'm a colts fan and they do it all the time.

REPLY: At one time, if I'm not mistaken, it was not reviewable. Then there was a high-profile mistake (allegedly) where Bill Cowher was running off the field at halftime livid, showing the referee one of those Polaroid shots they take that had their opponent (again, allegedly) with twelve guys on the field. After that, I believe, they made it a reviewable situation.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Bob M.

REPLY: At one time, if I'm not mistaken, it was not reviewable. Then there was a high-profile mistake (allegedly) where Bill Cowher was running off the field at halftime livid, showing the referee one of those Polaroid shots they take that had their opponent (again, allegedly) with twelve guys on the field. After that, I believe, they made it a reviewable situation.

I gave that example on the other site and I was not completely sure. Now I am surer that was the catalyst for that action.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by OverAndBack

Letter of the rule vs. spirit of the rule.

But, I guess if you go by the letter, you'll always be consistent. Fair enough.

I won't even characterize it that way. What *is* the spirit of the rule? That a team can take too much time substituting and still have someone running off the field at the snap as long as the guy doesn't take part in the play?

[Forksref]

I had a situation this past season near the end of the half. The team behind had the ball and wanted a timeout at the end of the down. Near the end of that play, the coach signaled to the wing official that he wanted a timeout. The wing official had the play coming toward him so he had to watch the play and stop the clock and dead-ball officiate. When I saw him signal to stop the clock, I looked to the clock and there was :01 left, then it ran to :00. So, we had a TO called with :01 on the clock, of which I had definite knowledge. Seeing :00 on the clock, the home team and coaches started toward the lockerroom. I cleared the field and we put :01 on the clock and ran one more play.

I think we did it the right way.

[OverAndBack]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I won't even characterize it that way. What *is* the spirit of the rule? That a team can take too much time substituting and still have someone running off the field at the snap as long as the guy doesn't take part in the play?

I reckon the spirit of the substitution rule, as you just expressed it, makes sense. I was speaking of the spirit of the rule that thou shalt not have 12 men on the field.

Which wasn't even the call in question, so I'm wrong.

Illegal substitution, yeah, that's it right there. You took too long. You blew it. I guess that's why it's an illegal substitution penalty and not illegal participation (what one might normally think of as "12 men on the field"). You gain no actual playing advantage when a guy is a step and a half (and I don't even think it was a step and a half) from the sideline and hustling to get off, but an illegal substitution, at this level, yeah, that's exactly right. My bad.

[HLin NC]

as to why the 12th player was on the field to begin with? How do you not know in the NFL if you are on the punt return team or not?