SCAB officials

[ref18]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

- the Provincial official's group had a major problem with the actions of the coach of a Senior team against the game officials at a semi-final game. They wanted him suspended for the championship game for these actions.

I was an official on the game in question, and while I won't give any details about what happened, I will say that what he did warranted at least a suspension.

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

imo officials anywhere at this age level should not involve themselves in situations involving major problems encountered by a fellow officiating group. "Brothers Under The Stripes" simply don't do that sort of thing.

I agree, I was shocked when I found out that American officials were actually doing the games. If I was asked to step in in this situation, I would definitely refuse. The only thing I can think of is that these officials did not know the whole story.

[jjrye22]

I found one real article about the theme. Doesn't say much, but it at least gives a background.

http://www.canada.com/windsorstar/st...d-ed973d35da5a

Personally I'd like to hear more about it.

James

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by SCAB

All I know is that I did a favor for somebody and helped cover the games so the kids could have their championship games. I had no idea all of this stuff was going on up there until it was too late.

All I do know is that the weather was beautiful, the field is beautiful, the games were good, and the kids seemed to have a good time.

It looks like you didn't do much of a favor to your fellow officials from another country though, does it SCAB? But hey, the weather was good, the field was beautiful, the games were good and the kids seemed to have a good time. And you made a few bucks too probably. Life is good.

Not to worry. I couldn't do what you did. Ever. But that's just me.

I read somewhere in that forum that you guys were from the Detroit area. Maybe an equivalent situation might be the MHSAA using you guys all year round and then telling you before the state championship games that they're bringing in officials from Illinois or Ohio...or Canada to do those games. Nothing the matter with that, right? I'm sure that the officials from Illinois or Ohio would never ask whatinthehell was going on either. They'd probably think that it was only a favor for someone.

One other thing....I see that the MHSAA posted a Code For Athletic Officials on it's website. #3 in that code states "Accept contracts for and officiate only contests for which you are qualified and experienced." I take it from that then that you are qualified and experienced in Canadian football. Correct?

[TXMike]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

It looks like you didn't do much of a favor to your fellow officials from another country though, does it SCAB? But hey, the weather was good, the field was beautiful, the games were good and the kids seemed to have a good time. And you made a few bucks too probably. Life is good.

Not to worry. I couldn't do what you did. Ever. But that's just me.

Well clearly none of us is going to get a straight story from the ref's side about what was going on up there so how can you blame someone for taking the game. Should they just have refused because some other association refused it? Most of us have been in associations where the group's leadership has done things that many of us in the group do not agree with. For all any of us know, that was the case here. I am all for defending my fellow zebras but only if I know they acted correctly. They do not get an automatic walk from me.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TXMike

They do not get an automatic walk from me.

Apparently.

Soooooo......there'd be no problem with the TUIL bringing in officials from Oklahoma to do playoff and championship games in Texas, I take it? And if someone from Oklahoma called you and said "Hey, TXMike, y'all come up and do our 5A championship high school game, you'd be there? You'd never dream of calling the Oklahoma officials first to find out whatinthehell was going on?

OKay.......

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

I think Mike asks a damn good question. Why are you being so evasive about everything?

You call these guys scabs but I don't see where your actions are anymore honorable.

Worse than apples and oranges: more like elephants and paper airplanes.

[TXMike]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Apparently.

Soooooo......there'd be no problem with the TUIL bringing in officials from Oklahoma to do playoff and championship games in Texas, I take it? And if someone from Oklahoma called you and said "Hey, TXMike, y'all come up and do our 5A championship high school game, you'd be there? You'd never dream of calling the Oklahoma officials first to find out whatinthehell was going on?

OKay.......

Me personally, I would not do the game in Oklahoma, nor the one in Canada. A man has to know his limitations and mine include limited brain capacity. Same reason I will not even do HS football here in Virginia. I only know 1 rule code, NCAA, and am incapable of learning another sufficiently to call a "big" game. How do we know the US refs did not inquire as to why they were being requested?

[JugglingReferee]

To the US officials that did the game:

I'm glad that the young athletes were able to play a game that awarded the championship trophies. To not have that played would be heart wrenching. The league was once a strong and vibrant league, and tonnes of fun to officiate. It is still fun to officiate, but there has been a noticable lack of leadership in the league administration this year.

You were put in a tough stituation. You didn't know all the facts, and likely heard from only one body: the league. There's no doubt in my mind that if the league did tell you details about the situation, they were vague at best, and flat out incorrect at worst.

• Also, did it ever occur to you to ask the league for a contact with the official's organization that normally covers the games? This is a provincial final - surely you didn't think the officiating was something of a low priority.
• The coach has been ejected from games 3 times. By league rule, he should have been ejected from the league... for life. But alas, he wasn't because he and a league executive coach Team Ontario together.
• As for Chief Referee, that wasn't him, I can almost assure you.

Edit: spelling

[Niner]

Interesting part of the article indicates that the striking officials union was paid in advance for the games and...

""They're breaking their contract, so there will probably be litigation after this," Rion said. "They (officials) are the only ones who get paid for their job in this (league) right now they're denying youth their championships."

Sad state of adulthood.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TXMike

1) A man has to know his limitations and mine include limited brain capacity. Same reason I will not even do HS football here in Virginia. I only know 1 rule code, NCAA, and am incapable of learning another sufficiently to call a "big" game.

2) How do we know the US refs did not inquire as to why they were being requested?

1) Original answer deleted due to a wrong assumption on my part.

2) That was one of my points. It's not normal imo not to question being asked to drive hundreds of miles to do games in another jurisdiction, let alone in another country using strange rules. Something had to be screwy.

Hopefully, it'll get straightened out, maybe not to both side's satisfaction but to something that both can live with.

That is one unbelievable fan forum to wade through though. Typical, I guess.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by SCAB

Jurrasic, asking TXMike about somebody from OK doing their 5A championships is like apples and oranges. This was represented to me as some type of summer youth tournament. I had never heard of the OVFL before this weekend. Turns out that it's a big deal in ON, but how would we know that? There's nothing simuliar in the States that I've ever heard of.

If somebody invited me into your area to do games, I'd sureasheck find out what the real deal was before coming in. And that includes contacting the local officials' group in your area and getting their input and permission.

That's just me though.

[TXMike]

Permission????? Maybe y'all look at things different but down here, officials are independent contractors. We do not need "permission" from other independent contractors to do work for a contractee.

So if a league decides they want to use a different ambulance service than the one they have been using, the new ambulance service should ask the old one for "permission" ?????

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TXMike

Permission????? Maybe y'all look at things different but down here, officials are independent contractors. We do not need "permission" from other independent contractors to do work for a contractee.

So if a league decides they want to use a different ambulance service than the one they have been using, the new ambulance service should ask the old one for "permission" ?????

Soooo...I can see there really isn't any problem in your mind with officials from Oklahoma coming in and doing high school playoffs or championship games in Texas.

We're independent contractors too. The difference is that we respect other independent contractors.

I guess I have been reading you wrongly.

Sad.

Jmo.....

[TXMike]

I could care less if Oklahoma officials come to Texas to work a PeeWee game.

And they would NEVER come to Texas to work a bigtime HS game involving only Texas teams. Coaches would not stand for it, nor would UIL. Both of whom realize they would be unable to get better officials than what they have at "home".

Guess that tells you the difference between Canada and Texas doesn't it?

[JRutledge]

It sounds to me like the officials that went up there did not know all the circumstances. Honestly, I would not expect them to know. When someone calls you to work a game, you do not ask a lot of questions. I have done games in other states and I did not know anything about why I was asked to work. We are not talking about major college or major pro sports here. We are talking about a local league that might not pay much money to work a single game. I think the term "scab" is a little misplaced in this thread.

Peace