Hurdling

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by iceman70

JRutledge,

Just curious, rule 9-4-3f, "Throw a helmet to trip an opponent". If the player jumps and the helmet misses him, no flag right?

It could have been worded, "Throw a helmet AND trip an opponent".

You can look for all the scenarios that you like. I stand by what I said and how I am going to call this. If you cannot tell the difference in the statement above, this is something you will have to deal with.

I do know that last year (or a couple of years ago) there was a call made in a state final where I live that someone called helping the runner and took the rulebook so literally. The call was widely questioned even thought the language could have been technically right.

Peace

[iceman70]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You can look for all the scenarios that you like. I stand by what I said and how I am going to call this. If you cannot tell the difference in the statement above, this is something you will have to deal with.

I do know that last year (or a couple of years ago) there was a call made in a state final where I live that someone called helping the runner and took the rulebook so literally. The call was widely questioned even thought the language could have been technically right.

Peace

JRutledge,

I can tell the difference between both statements. The first one indicates that the throwing of the helmet is what makes it illegal. In the second, it is only illegal if it makes contact.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by iceman70

JRutledge,

I can tell the difference between both statements. The first one indicates that the throwing of the helmet is what makes it illegal. In the second, it is only illegal if it makes contact.

OK, find me the NF ruling that says how to apply the rule?

I am waiting.

Peace

[iceman70]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

OK, find me the NF ruling that says how to apply the rule?

I am waiting.

Peace

If a player throws his helmet at another player, who needs specific instructions from the NF? It is possible to overanalyze nearly every rule.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by iceman70

If a player throws his helmet at another player, who needs specific instructions from the NF? It is possible to overanalyze nearly every rule.

My point to you is if you want consistency in how people call something or the justification for it, you better put it in writing to at the very least take away the different interpretations. If you do not think that happens, why did the NF change the rule about PI to the area of the field the ball is thrown? Officials were already using common sense and not calling DPI to the opposite side of the field.

After all these rules are under Illegal Personal Contact. I do not think it is too much to require some kind of contact. But this is why we get paid to make the big bucks. These are judgments we will have to make.

Peace

[MJT]

2-21 HURDLING
Hurdling is an attempt by a player to jump with one or both feet or knees foremost over an opponent who is contacting the ground with no part of his body except one or both feet.

9-4 ILLEGAL PERSONAL CONTACT
ART. 1 . . . No player or nonplayer shall fight.
ART. 2 . . . No player or nonplayer shall intentionally contact an official.
ART. 3 . . . No player or nonplayer shall:

a. Swing the foot, shin or knee into an opponent, nor extend the knee to meet a blocker.
b. Charge into or throw an opponent to the ground after he is obviously out of the play, or after the ball is clearly dead either in or out of bounds.
c. Pile on any player who is lying on the ground.
d. Hurdle an opponent.
e. Position himself on the shoulders or body of a teammate or opponent to gain an advantage.
f. Throw a helmet to trip an opponent.
g. Make any other contact with an opponent which is deemed unnecessary and which incites roughness.

h. Grasp an opponent's face mask or any edge of a helmet opening.
i. Butt block, face tackle or spear.
j. Intentionally use his helmet to butt or ram an opponent.
l. Strike an opponent with his fist, locked hands, forearm or elbow, nor kick or knee him.
Penalty - Other personal fouls (Arts. 3a through g) – (S38) – 15 yards;

The definition does not say any contact must be made and rule 9 says illegal to hurdle, no mention of contact needed. So in NF, if you hurdle, whether there is contact or not, it is BY RULE, a foul.

I just don't see how you can say this is a judgement call in this case when it meets the definition of hurdling in rule 2 and a foul in rule 9.

[JRutledge]

Call whatever you like. Then hope and pray that the people work for you feel the same way. I learned a long time ago that what you call and what is accepted are two different things. Do not be a maverick.

Peace