Face masks

[OverAndBack]

Had two different face mask calls in a game this week and I think we got the enforcement correct, but I just want to check:

• A 2nd and 10 at B's 40. A25 runs off left tackle and gets face masked at B39. I throw the flag. At the B37, A25 fumbles, the ball bounces ahead and is recovered by A at B's 34. I had flagged the face mask at the spot of the foul and beanbagged the fumble. We enforced five yards from the end of the related run (which ended at the beanbag), taking it to the 32 and no first down. Did we get that right?
• A 1st and 10 at their own 1 after a goal line stand. A12 drops back and gets face masked in a big way about a yard deep in the end zone as he's sacked. We enforced from the goal line 10 yards (the longest penalty this junior high league allows is a 10 yarder) and made it 1-10 at the 10. Did we get that right?

Thanks.

[MJT]

Originally Posted by OverAndBack

Had two different face mask calls in a game this week and I think we got the enforcement correct, but I just want to check:

• A 2nd and 10 at B's 40. A25 runs off left tackle and gets face masked at B39. I throw the flag. At the B37, A25 fumbles, the ball bounces ahead and is recovered by A at B's 34. I had flagged the face mask at the spot of the foul and beanbagged the fumble. We enforced five yards from the end of the related run (which ended at the beanbag), taking it to the 32 and no first down. Did we get that right?

• If you repeated the down, 2nd-2 from the 32, yes if it was only a 5 yard FM. There is no need to have the flag at the spot of the foul as since it is by the defense, the foul will never be enforced from the spot of the foul.

• A 1st and 10 at their own 1 after a goal line stand. A12 drops back and gets face masked in a big way about a yard deep in the end zone as he's sacked. We enforced from the goal line 10 yards (the longest penalty this junior high league allows is a 10 yarder) and made it 1-10 at the 10. Did we get that right?

Your enforcement spot is correct. In NF it would be a 15 yarder enforced from the goal line.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by MJT

If you repeated the down, 2nd-2 from the 32, yes if it was only a 5 yard FM. There is no need to have the flag at the spot of the foul as since it is by the defense, the foul will never be enforced from the spot of the foul.[*]
Your enforcement spot is correct. In NF it would be a 15 yarder enforced from the goal line.

Thanks.

[/QUOTE]

MJT - you say that the foul will never be enforced from the spot of the foul, and then in the 2nd sitch, you enforce from the spot of the foul. Odd.

Edited to add - ok, I get it on the 2nd now. My bad. Responded too quickly.

[OverAndBack]

Right, the "spot" of the foul in the first instance doesn't matter for that particular foul, just pointing out that that related run ended at a certain point prior to the end of the play. You still have to throw the flag, but where it lands doesn't matter for that particular foul (unlike for a hold, for example).

In the second one, we're not enforcing from the spot of the foul, but since the end of the related run was behind the goal line, we have to enforce from the goal line.

If the quarterback had thrown the ball incomplete, would it have been enforced from the previous spot (the 1 yard line)? Not that it mattered in the end.

[Smiley]

In the second one, wouldn't it be 1st and 1 from the ten?

[mcrowder]

PF FM = Auto 1st down

[Forksref]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

PF FM = Auto 1st down

Not in FED ball. Only automatics are the 3 roughings and DPI.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by OverAndBack

A 2nd and 10 at B's 40. A25 runs off left tackle and gets face masked at B39. I throw the flag. At the B37, A25 fumbles, the ball bounces ahead and is recovered by A at B's 34. I had flagged the face mask at the spot of the foul and beanbagged the fumble. We enforced five yards from the end of the related run (which ended at the beanbag), taking it to the 32 and no first down.

UR-FM before LTG is applied from PLS or Point Ball Dead (PBD). In this case, apply 15y+AFD at the B-34 = A 1D/10 @ B-19.

Originally Posted by OverAndBack

A 1st and 10 at their own 1 after a goal line stand. A12 drops back and gets face masked in a big way about a yard deep in the end zone as he's sacked. We enforced from the goal line 10 yards (the longest penalty this junior high league allows is a 10 yarder) and made it 1-10 at the 10.

UR-FM before LTG is applied from PLS or Point Ball Dead (PBD). In this case, apply 15y+AFD at the A-1 = A 1D/10 @ A-16.

[MJT]

Originally Posted by Forksref

Not in FED ball. Only automatics are the 3 roughings and DPI.

You must be considering RTKicker and RTHolder to be one to have 3 roughings and not 4?

[OverAndBack]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

UR-FM before LTG is applied from PLS or Point Ball Dead (PBD). In this case, apply 15y+AFD at the B-34 = A 1D/10 @ B-19.

UR-FM before LTG is applied from PLS or Point Ball Dead (PBD). In this case, apply 15y+AFD at the A-1 = A 1D/10 @ A-16.

OMG.

.....

[Forksref]

Originally Posted by MJT

You must be considering RTKicker and RTHolder to be one to have 3 roughings and not 4?

Yep RTK/H as one.