A question of Ethics?

[CruiseMan]

As part of preventative officiating, there are certain things we say during the course of play to make sure no one gets hurt. The umpire and/or referee will say "ball's gone" or "ball's away" once a pass or kick is in flight.

On a long breakaway, with the runner 15 yards ahead of everyone, the trailing official might be saying "no blocks, no blocks".

My question is this scenario.

4 and 10 from B20. A lines up for a FG. The kick is blocked and it caroms to the right, lands and rolls to a stop on the 3 yd line, near the sideline. B32 is the first one to arrive at the ball, he approaches it tentatively and looks at the LJ who simply says... "live". At the time, the next closest player was 10 yards away. B32 picks it up and runs for a touchdown.

Good or Bad?

[schmitty1973]

Depends, is B the home team or visiting team? DOH!

[Snake~eyes]

I wouldn't say anything, the reason we say the other things is for safety. During the play I would just officiate.

[mcrowder]

Awful.

[GBFBUmp]

Originally posted by Snake~eyes
I wouldn't say anything, the reason we say the other things is for safety. During the play I would just officiate.

I would say it depends on the level?

At the younger levels (7th/8th grade, freshmen) we tend to help out on the little things, make suggestions, etc. if its warranted.

Varsity and JV definitely not. Then only make suggestions related to safety.

[NothernVA_Ump]

I had this almost exact play happen to me a few years ago. It was at a Freshman game. We work 4 man mechanics on freshman/JV games. As the Umpire I was under the goal post. I do not believe the kick was blocked but saw the ball hit at the 10 (it was about a 35-40 yard attempt), so I came from under the post to the wide side of the field to continue officiating. B1 picks up the ball and starts to hand me the ball. I back away without saying anything. B1 starts to run and gets tackled at the 20. Halftime.

[Bob M.]

REPLY: Definitely bad. The covering official should neither say nor do anything in this case. That should be a 'clue' for B32 and anyone else watching. However, if neither he nor any other player makes an attempt to recover the loose ball, it should be declared dead in a fairly short order.

[Bob M.]

Originally posted by GBFBUmp

At the younger levels (7th/8th grade, freshmen) we tend to help out on the little things, make suggestions, etc. if its warranted.

REPLY: Even at the younger levels, in this situation, I wouldn't say anything during the live ball for fear of giving one team an advantage. I'd probably just declare the ball dead (according to rule) and afterwards tell B32 right there (and maybe his coach at an opportune time) that the ball was live and that he could have recovered and advanced if he wanted to.

[GBFBUmp]

Originally posted by Bob M.

REPLY: Even at the younger levels, in this situation, I wouldn't say anything during the live ball for fear of giving one team an advantage. I'd probably just declare the ball dead (according to rule) and afterwards tell B32 right there (and maybe his coach at an opportune time) that the ball was live and that he could have recovered and advanced if he wanted to.

That makes sense. Need to make sure the instruction is done at the right time, without giving advantage.

[Suudy]

Originally posted by Bob M.
I'd probably just declare the ball dead (according to rule) and afterwards tell B32 right there (and maybe his coach at an opportune time) that the ball was live and that he could have recovered and advanced if he wanted to.

We had an slightly different scenario occur in a varsity game last season. A punts the ball about 30 yards. The ball is bouncing around and the deep guy (call him B1) is yelling "Get away!" B1 is hovering near the ball while it is surrounded by A players. A1 slaps the ball into the ground (i.e. touching it down) and the A players run off towards their sidelines. The BJ blows the ball dead after the ball is slapped and as the A players are running off.

Now the B coach (on my sidelines) is furious because he said his guy was going to pick up the ball and run it. He said that he's been coaching his guys to make sure the the punting team picks up the ball. If they don't he coaches them to pick it up and run and take advantage of first touching.

Now I know he is technically correct, since the ball was neither completely at rest nor possesed by A. How do you guys handle this situation?

[JasonTX]

This happened last year in a game (7th grade) I had as well, except we didn't blow the whistle since the ball was not dead by rule. Several kicking team players touched the ball and then they all were departing from that location. The line judge looked to see if there were any receivers going to attempt to get the ball and sure enough a player was "high tailing" it over there and picked up the ball and gained 50 yards or so. No arguments from the kickers coach. He talked to his players and every punt from then on out they would pick the ball up to make it become dead. This play appeared to teach the entire school a lesson. From then on out every team from 7th grade thru Varsity from that school would pick the ball up. There was no more touching and then running away from it.

[mcrowder]

Suudy, I'm not sure what the best adjective is for me to use in this situation to differentiate from your adjective of "technically" correct. He's not just technically correct, he's completely correct, and completely within his rights to be furious. In essence, you had an inadvertent whistle, and needed to handle it that way.

How do I handle it? Don't blow the whistle. It's not dead.

Originally posted by mcrowder
Suudy, I'm not sure what the best adjective is for me to use in this situation to differentiate from your adjective of "technically" correct. He's not just technically correct, he's completely correct, and completely within his rights to be furious. In essence, you had an inadvertent whistle, and needed to handle it that way.

How do I handle it? Don't blow the whistle. It's not dead.

very good point mcrowder!

[The Roamin' Umpire]

Originally posted by Bob M.
REPLY: Definitely bad. The covering official should neither say nor do anything in this case. That should be a 'clue' for B32 and anyone else watching.

Yup. This is very standard across several sports; certainly in baseball the mechanic when the ball is live and no one realizes it is to do nothing. (And if the catcher tries to flip the ball to you, just back away and let it hit the ground. Someone usually takes the hint at that point.)

[Tom.OH]

Cruiseman, I do yell "Balls away" on passes and punts but would never yell "NO blocks" on a long ron. Thats what coaches are for. Do you really do that?