How far do you go?

[Biscuit]

I asked this question last night at an association meeting and didn't really get an answer. When a wideout comes up to the line and looks at you to help them line up on the line, how far do you go to help them? What I try to do is show them where the line is and leave it at that. Especially on the varsity level I feel that they should know where to set up at. Last Friday night the offense ran a bunch formation where 3 players came to my side. The one who was apparently supposed to be on the line would look over at me to verify his position. I simply would say, "here's the line" and show him with my feet. Well this kid was at least 1 yard off the line, so I flagged it. Not 7 on the line. The coach got upset and told me that he was looking over at me to get "my opinion." I told the coach that I couldn't coach his kid on where to line up, especially since I don't really know if he's supposed to be on or off for sure and that if I knew he was supposed to be on and I had him move forward and the QB took the snap, I have just created a false start for him. He understood, but I don't think his player ever did. How do you all handle this?

[irefky]

biscuit, preventive officiating, please! I have worked the wings for several years, when a player looks at me, I help them by putting my hand up to signal stop, means they are good, or point forward or backwards. Coaches don't care as long as you do it for both. I do it for the defense if they ask. However, I personally think your association should be on the same page so schools would have a consistancy from all officials who would work their games.

[golfdesigner]

I am a new official, at a clinic I was told as a wingman, when the kid comes out of the huddle and he looks at me to check whether he is on the line or off the line, I should say "You're a back" or "You're an End". I did that the other day in a Frosh game, #88 looked at me, I said "You're a back", that ended up making him the fifth in the backfield, I of course tossed the hanky. Coach kind of complained that the kid had checked and thought he was okay. I told coach I told him "he was a back", coach said maybe he thought I told him to "move back". I can see the confusion. At the clinic that said if you tell him he's an end or he's a back he should know where he is supposed to line up for the play, guess what...wrong.
From now on I'm going to use "You're on the Line" or "You're off the line" and see what kind of response I get with that.

Just my $0.02

[Dale Smith]

Most of the time, this is a preventable foul. Why throw the flag when you shouldn’t have to? Show the wideout where the line is with your foot and then tell him that he is on the line or off the line.

[ref18]

There is absolutely nothing wrong telling them whether or not they're on the line if they're unsure.

Remember you have the best view of the line and it's your opinion that matters not theirs, so if they're out of position and they make a signal that's asking if they're on the line, I'm gonna tell them. Either, "You're good" "back up" "move up".

I do it for both teams and both coaches appreciate the fact that they're not getting penalized for preventable fouls.

[lucky1313]

I tell them to ask me if they are on the line or off. I want them to declare what position they want. Then I can try to help them as much as possible.

[golfdesigner]

Originally posted by ref18
There is absolutely nothing wrong telling them whether or not they're on the line if they're unsure.

Remember you have the best view of the line and it's your opinion that matters not theirs, so if they're out of position and they make a signal that's asking if they're on the line, I'm gonna tell them. Either, "You're good" "back up" "move up".

I do it for both teams and both coaches appreciate the fact that they're not getting penalized for preventable fouls.

I was told not to do this because you don't know if they're supposed to be in the backfield on on the LOS. If you tell them to move up when they should be in the backfield or move back when they're supposed to be on the LOS. I thought the "you're a back or you're an end" should of worked, but really the "you're on the line or you're off the line" is probably the best, if they are lining up in the NZ, and they look at me I'll tell them to back up a tad, so they don't get an encroachment foul, that is preventable, but as far as on the LOS or in the Backfield, I think I will go with you're on the line or you're off the line.

[jrfath]

It is very important to read the formation to make the formation right, no matter what the level.

If a WR is not quite breaking the plan of the waist of the nearest player on the line...but by reading the formation you know he is supposed to be on the line, just put him on, and tell him after the play to be sure to get up to the line if that is where he is supposed to line up. He is gaining no advantage being 6 inches in the backfield. If the receiver is from the team on your sideline, turn around and tell the coach too, and then he can take care of it.

Myself as a linesman, I give them my backfield foot as a reference to where he needs to line up if he is on the line. I point to it when he breaks the huddle, telling him "here is your line of scrimmage". If he lines up close to it, I tell him "you are on the line". If he does not, I tell him "you are off the line."

Try to avoid "you are good", b/c your 'good' may be different than the receiver's 'good'.

Just let him know if he is on or off, and the receiver can take it from there.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally posted by ref18
There is absolutely nothing wrong telling them whether or not they're on the line if they're unsure.

Remember you have the best view of the line and it's your opinion that matters not theirs, so if they're out of position and they make a signal that's asking if they're on the line, I'm gonna tell them. Either, "You're good" "back up" "move up".

I do it for both teams and both coaches appreciate the fact that they're not getting penalized for preventable fouls.

Don't use phrases like "you're good". That implies that you're reading their intentions, which may or may not be accurate and their intentions may change.

tell them their current status. On the line or off the line. If there's a TE, ask them if they're SURE they need to be on the line.

[ref18]

Originally posted by JugglingReferee

Don't use phrases like "you're good". That implies that you're reading their intentions, which may or may not be accurate and their intentions may change.

tell them their current status. On the line or off the line. If there's a TE, ask them if they're SURE they need to be on the line.

If they're on the line or within the vicinity of the line, and my umpire points out that I need an end, and they put their hand up to signal that they're that end, then I have no problem assuming that they should be on the line and I will try to direct them in.

If I know there's a TE then I won't bother with them, unless they're standing in the NZ.

[mcrowder]

Friday nights? Put the foot out - they are old enough to know whether they should be on or off.

Below that? Even for JV, I'll tell them "You're on", "You're Off", or even "Back up" if they are hanging over the neutral zone. Peewee - that's where you might try reading the formation.

True story from my first year (maybe 3rd day) - I read the formation, noticing that he was the 8th man on the line, and told him to back up. Sure enough, after they get set, the wing on the OTHER side backs up a step, sets for a second, and then goes in motion. The other wing flagged it for formation. It was MY fault that my WR was in the backfield. I'll never do that again at JH or High school ages.

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally posted by mcrowder
Friday nights?

What if your V games are on Saturday afternoons?

Personally, if the guy comes out and looks at me, first thing I say is "ON OR OFF?" Then I'll let him know when hes in good position to be where he wants to be. If he just comes out and lines up on his own like he knows what he's doing, that's fine. But if he's looking to me to get lined up, and I'm telling him to move up or back or whatever to get where he wants to be, I'm pretty hard pressed to flag him for a false start if he doesn't get set for a full second.

[jrfath]

It all comes down to common sense and preventive officiating. Use those, and you will be in good shape.

[Biscuit]

But what if he doesn't get set at all. While you are moving him up, back, whatever, the ball is snapped and the coach on your sideline is wanting something called? It just seems to me that if you show him the line, a varsity player should be able to line up right. Not trying be flag happy or anything.

[schmitty1973]

I agree with biscuit. What if he's moving back because you told him and then the other coach complains? I also notice that when I ask the player if he's "On" or "Off" sometimes it's hard to tell what he says because of his mouthpiece. All you hear is "OOoottthhhhhhh" What's that mean ?!?
One thing I did notice, if a player breaks a huddle and is looking at me or pointing at me or something, usually he's supposed to be on the line.