Motion vs False Start

[chiefgil]

Blow your whistle, stop the play, call False Start. I'm sure the Umpire can use the time to catch his breath.

[SJoldguy]

The thread doesn't say if the wide receiver is a back or an end. Backs and ends in this situation will be treated in the same way for some actions and differently for others.
It is a false start if any player simulates action at the snap. Back can go in motion after all 11 offensive players have set for 1 second and doesn't have to stop. An end can also go in motion but there better be 7 other players legally on the line. If the end stops for one second in the backfield he becomes a back and is subject to the motion rules as a back. If he fails to stop, he must be at least 5 yards behind the LOS when the ball is snapped. Wing men should judge first if the wide receiver is either guilty of false start or if he encroached. If yes to either, blow it dead. If not, be ready to call a motion violation if it is one. Did anyone here consider that Team A can call time out to avoid the motion penalty!!! In this situation, you must first know the rules on FS, IM, Illegal shift, encroachment,and illegal formation(i.e six on line), then see the action, then make the call,.

[cowbyfan1]

Common thought is that the wide out can reset. However in this case he moved forward and was on the line. False start. If he is off the line and does this I would have nothing as long as he was the only one moving, and since he was moving backwards at the snap it would not be motion.

[WyMike]

Amazing...

I had the very same thing this weekend involving a receiver in the slot on the far side of me. We worked a Varsity game Friday night, then three games from JV down on Saturday. I'm Linesman.

9th Grade Coach on my side had been working me on some calls which were marginal in the LJ's area, but LJ had officiated for many years and had a ton of experience. A tight game was developing and of course they were rivals!

A comes to the line and all are set with no one in motion. B is salivating to come off the ball and punish any A player. QB is shouting signals and on a hard count when slot man takes one quick step forward with his front foot. No one else is moving, and he quickly 'hangs his head' then steps back quickly into original stance.

B coach is hollering at me simultaneously as I look across at LJ who is doing nothing. I toss a flag and head to the middle to consult where I'm told by the LJ it was a 'shift' and not a False Start.

A shift is actually shifting to a new position, intentionally, right? It was painfully obvious this A player forgot the count and jumped.

Judging by the thread there is a lot of discrepancy and interpretation of this movement. I believe it to be a FS. Yes he quickly shifted forward and back, but is this the true intent of the rule? A 'Shift' shouldn't be construed as 'shifting' in one position should it? Shouldn't it be a shift to a NEW position? How many times could A supposedly shift in one spot repeatedly even though he was still for a full second?

This newbie believes it to be a False Start and the Shift is being too broadly interpreted in favor of A. But did give way to the more experienced officials in the ruling.

By the way, B coach wasn't impresseed with my flag being waved off and the ruling of 'Shifting'.



[Edited by WyMike on Oct 5th, 2004 at 09:27 AM]

[Bob M.]

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser

I disagree.

REPLY: Rich, here's a real-life play that happened when I was a younger LJ: WR misses the snap count and begins to move forward just before the snap. He stops when he realizes his mistake. The DB who's playing him heads up on the line, stands up to point out the transgression. I'm working from the old "he can reset" mentality. The ball is snapped as the WR resets. So I've got an illegal shift. The WR blows by the DB who has relaxed thinking that a FS would be called. The DB reaches out and grabs him to neutralize the advantage. The ball is thrown just over the WR's head. Now I have to go back to the R and report a double foul. If I had killed it (which we always do now in such cases), only A would have been penalized.

The comment about "nothing good can come from letting that play go" was not mine, but rather that of a friend who worked in the Big East and is now in the NFL. Both NCAA and the NFL call it a FS whenever any Team A player apparently misses the count and feigns a charge that simulates action at the snap.

[Jim S]

Bob has pointed out the main point to remember regarding false starts. NO player may make a move that simulates the start of the play. The provision that allows some players to move and then reset does not extend to movements that be used at the start of a play. ie: the WR moving forward.

Then there is the legal movement that got me yelled at for most of a game last night. Tailback would often start a 1/2 count early, but with a sideways step. No forward movement. No one else in motion. After the snap he would head toward the line.
Now as an old defensive lineman I used to love to see this kind of thing. Let me know when the ball was going to be snapped. And with my speed (lack of), I needed all the help I could get.
But this defensive coach was screaming until I had a chance to talk to him during a T.O in the 4th quarter. 1. about the rules, 2. about why he was complaining that the back was tipping of the snap.
He got the funniest look on his face, like a new concept was trying to work it's way into the old rock.

[WyMike]

Are we now in agreement this can be interpreted as a False Start?

[KWH]

Originally posted by WyMike
Are we now in agreement this can be interpreted as a False Start?

We have not head from Rich F, but everyone else seems to be on board!

[Rich]

Originally posted by KWH

We have not head from Rich F, but everyone else seems to be on board!

If the receiver is up on the line, sure, I'll be on board.

Also, a play was posted where the defender hung his head -- reacted -- to the receiver jumping and then held to recover. Again, I would call THAT a false start.

It's the time that a receiver is lined up as a back and steps forward right before the snap where I see it as a motion penalty.

A halfback/tailback/fullback? It's likely going to be a motion penalty if he moves forward.

--Rich

[red]

I finally got a chance to read the replies to my response.

1. The player was on the LOS
2. Player stepped forward one step, back same step
3. Was not set for 1 sec.


In my judgement - false start. Call - motion.