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Old Thu Nov 20, 2003, 11:08pm
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in the TCU vs. USM game tonight, did anyone see the pooch kick in the fourth quarter? is the rule the same as in high school where the ball must go ten yards and touch either the ground or the receiving team before K can recover? i think the officials blew that one tonight and it could of turned out to be a huge call. i also believe they had kick catch intereference along with that first touching. it is hard for me to believe that 7 officials missed a call like that. hopefully for them the college rule is different. i hope someone out there can clarify this for me.
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 06:14am
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Yes the ball has to travel 10 yards but no it does not have to touch the ground or a player. But, if a receiving team player is attempting to catch the kick and is positioned such that he could do so, he has to be given an unmolested opportunity to do so. I only saw 1 shot of the play but sure looked like KCI. Maybe the guys on the ground saw something else?
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 08:03am
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Yankeesfan...I though the same thing. I know that in Federation rules the ball can't be caught out of the air on a free kick by K (missed that question on a quiz that we were taking at an association meeting). I also agree that there was KCI (althought the ESPN crew seemd to think that he had to give a fair catch signal before there could be KCI).
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 09:53am
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I was going to post a question on the same play. If the NCAA rule is as I understand it, and as posted here, I agree there was KCI, and yes it could have had a huge impact (multi million dollar) impact on the game and college football in general..What makes it even more unbelievable that it got missed is the fact that the Indianapolis Colts got away with the same infraction against the Buccaneers a few weeks ago in the big comeback on Monday Night Football. The NFL even came out and said that call had been botched on the same play..I know we took a little time at our next meeting to discuss that situation, cause like it or not what people see on Sunday and Monday, they try to incorporate on Tues through Friday....
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 12:37pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by sloth
Yankeesfan...I though the same thing. I know that in Federation rules the ball can't be caught out of the air on a free kick by K (missed that question on a quiz that we were taking at an association meeting). I also agree that there was KCI (althought the ESPN crew seemd to think that he had to give a fair catch signal before there could be KCI).
To me, looking at replay, his FC signal was very weak. He was running up and his hand was up by his top part of his facemask. I was almost thinking invalid FC signal. Anyone else think this? Question: Even wiht an invalid signal, he is still protected correct????

Imagine, and ESPN TV booth crew getting a call or rule wrong. Does not happen, even wiht Joe T..
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 01:01pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by sm_bbcoach
Even wiht an invalid signal, he is still protected correct????
NFHS, no protection and R cannot advance the ball but R has to catch the ball before they hit him. Or you'll have KCI. Everybody agree?

[Edited by Snake~eyes on Nov 21st, 2003 at 12:04 PM]
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 01:28pm
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snake eyes, yep I agree, but in NHFS with or without the fair catch if there is a reciever in position to make the catch, and I think there was, it is KCI correct?? I don't have my books with me so am not sure, or does that statement about a reciever in position only apply to scrimmage kicks....I called one of the guys I work with who also works D-1 he had his books with him and according to what he could find everything was legal on the play so they got it right...even to the point that in the NCAA there cannot be a fair catch on a free kick, and the ball doesn't have to touch the ground before K can touch it, it only has to go and stay beyond the free kick restraining line...at least that is all he could find on short notice...and he was glad to look it up cause he is a field judge and needs to know such things LOL....
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 01:38pm
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Opportunity to make the catch

First,

I don't do football, but came here to get clarification of this play.

After reading the posts, I then read NCAA rulebook and the rule seems to protect the reciever from being impeded in an attempt to catch the ball; but doesn't really cover the ball being caught by the kicking team.

Is KCI applicable when the player attempted to make a catch is not impeded?

I'm just trying to understand the ruling.
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 02:13pm
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Kboy, in your reading of the NCAA rules were you in the free kick area of the book or the scrimmage kick area, it might make a difference....
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 02:45pm
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Free Kick

I was in the Free Kick section, or at least I think I was.
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 04:48pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by cmathews
snake eyes, yep I agree, but in NHFS with or without the fair catch if there is a reciever in position to make the catch, and I think there was, it is KCI correct?? I don't have my books with me so am not sure, or does that statement about a reciever in position only apply to scrimmage kicks....I called one of the guys I work with who also works D-1 he had his books with him and according to what he could find everything was legal on the play so they got it right...even to the point that in the NCAA there cannot be a fair catch on a free kick, and the ball doesn't have to touch the ground before K can touch it, it only has to go and stay beyond the free kick restraining line...at least that is all he could find on short notice...and he was glad to look it up cause he is a field judge and needs to know such things LOL....
Next time you speak with your D-1 friend refer him to rule 6-4-1. Interference with oppurtunity. A player of the receiving team withing the boundary lines attempting to catch a kick, and so located that he could have caught a FREE KICK (which this was) or a scrimmage kick that is beyond the neutral zone, must be given an unimpeded oppurtunity to catch the kick. (a) This protection terminates when the kick touches the ground or is touched by any player of Team B player.
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 04:56pm
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jason, thanks that is what we were looking for
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 09:38pm
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As I said in my first post, I do not know the NCAA rule, but I dug up the Federation rule. Rule 6-1-5...Any kicking team member may recover a free kick if it has both touched the ground and gone beyond the plane of the free kick line. The two requirements may occur in any order.

Si not only was the first touching by K, but also (in my opinion) KCI (despite the lack of a valid fair catch signal (again in my opinion).
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 10:14pm
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Sloth, in NHFS yes you are abosolutely correct...
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Old Fri Nov 21, 2003, 10:19pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Snake~eyes
Quote:
Originally posted by sm_bbcoach
Even wiht an invalid signal, he is still protected correct????
NFHS, no protection and R cannot advance the ball but R has to catch the ball before they hit him. Or you'll have KCI. Everybody agree?

[Edited by Snake~eyes on Nov 21st, 2003 at 12:04 PM]
If your D-1 buddy needed to refer to a rulebook on this simple play then he has some real problems. If the receiver was moving towards the ball and the kicking team player got in the way, that is interference, even if the kicking team player does not touch the ball or the receiver. It is even more so if he touches either one before ball has touched ground or a player.
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