Targeting calls - Week 1 (Video)

[Robert Goodman]

Is targeting a no-fault foul?

In video #2 I'm looking at the defender's legs. Just before he makes contact w his R shoulder, he takes a long step w his R foot. He's putting on the brakes. Along w that move, he's rotating at the shoulders to "get skinny" as we say in coaching. It looks like he's trying to avoid contact, but can't get skinny enough to miss.

I'm thinking about what would happen had he not applied the brakes and kept both shoulders facing the opponent. Seems to me the opponent still gets hit above the shoulders, but the player who fouled would've taken a bad blow himself.

Also, on a softer field he might've succeeded in avoiding contact.

[CT1]

You’re kidding, right? There’s no way he was trying to avoid contact.

He could have extended his arms and legally pushed the runner OOB, but instead chose to deliver an illegal “big hit”.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by CT1

You’re kidding, right? There’s no way he was trying to avoid contact.

He could have extended his arms and legally pushed the runner OOB, but instead chose to deliver an illegal “big hit”.

Exactly. Two hands and push him OOB. Instead he went shoulder to helmet. That's a DQ in a HS game, as well, for flagrant targeting.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by CT1

You’re kidding, right? There’s no way he was trying to avoid contact.

He could have extended his arms and legally pushed the runner OOB, but instead chose to deliver an illegal “big hit”.

Could be/might be, depending on what the covering official observed and whether or not he "judged" the contact to be "flagrant. This particular play is long over and done with

At the NFHS level, "disqualification" is NOT automatic, and is specific to EACH situation.

[JRutledge]

I do not know that I would disqualify any kid in HS for these actions if the helmet hit the player. This is the procedure at the NCAA level, I would need more to eject a player at the HS level.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I do not know that I would disqualify any kid in HS for these actions if the helmet hit the player. This is the procedure at the NCAA level, I would need more to eject a player at the HS level.



Peace

What, death on the field?


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[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Rich

What, death on the field?


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Yes Rich, death on the field. Yes, that is the absolute worst hit that has ever taken place in the targeting era, let alone in football in the last 30 years. He gets there a little later and that hit is not even with the head. I saw a worse hit last year with Michigan and Florida and it was not even a targeting foul after replay.



Peace

[CT1]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

He gets there a little later and that hit is not even with the head.

Which is why the FED rule specifies “helmet, forearm, hand, fist, elbow or shoulders.” 2-20-2

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by CT1

You’re kidding, right? There’s no way he was trying to avoid contact.

He could have extended his arms and legally pushed the runner OOB, but instead chose to deliver an illegal “big hit”.

Would you coach a player in such a situation to extend his arms so as to hit w the hands? Whenever I see that, it looks like contact is deliberate. Such a hit may still be legal, but in situations where it's marginal as to whether a hit could be judged a late one, I'd've coached what this player did to try to rotate his shoulders out of the way. Are officials now looking at extended arms as a good faith attempt to avoid an illegal hit?

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Are officials now looking at extended arms as a good faith attempt to avoid an illegal hit?

That's what we've been told to look for, and what coaches are being told to teach.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Are officials now looking at extended arms as a good faith attempt to avoid an illegal hit?

Actually no. If you use your head illegally your arms are not helping avoid a foul. Players will wrap and hit a receiver or passer high anyway.

Peace

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Actually no. If you use your head illegally your arms are not helping avoid a foul. Players will wrap and hit a receiver or passer high anyway.

No, I don't mean a situation where you're using your own head illegally, but using your opponent's head illegally, as in this video. If #14 instead of rotating at the shoulders had extended his arms and wound up hitting the opponent's head or neck w his hand, is that a foul? Is it the same kind of foul?

[CT1]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

No, I don't mean a situation where you're using your own head illegally, but using your opponent's head illegally, as in this video. If #14 instead of rotating at the shoulders had extended his arms and wound up hitting the opponent's head or neck w his hand, is that a foul? Is it the same kind of foul?

See the FED rule I quoted above. A striking blow with the hands to an opponent’s head is a foul.

But that wasn’t my point. A defender who attempts to push a runner OOB (or to the ground) probably isn’t aiming for the head, and is much less likely to be flagged for targeting. This defender intentionally led with his shoulder.