For the release, I can stand at floor level and observe the players in the marked lane spaces as well as see the shooter with the ball in his hands and determine when it is released. All of this is easily within my field of vision.

For the ball contacting the ring or backboard, I cannot (especially from the Lead position) see that instant without having to look up and in a different location than where the players along the lane are. My field of view does not contain both of these.

The above is why I much prefer the release for judging FT violations as opposed to contact on the ring or backboard.

Again for the NFHS to now add a second moment which the L and C must observe in order to properly determine violations is poor.

I would offer that a mechanics change should be made to make this secondary violation the responsibility of the T in 3-man as the T is already taking the players outside of the 3pt line and their restriction is when the ball contacts the ring or backboard. For 2-man, I believe that the NFHS has given the officials an impossible task--observe two different timing points for violations in two different locations as well as clean up rough play in the rebounding action as the players enter the lane.

Given that I said the ball was still live, what do you think?

Yeah I would call a common foul if I had a do-over. Not a tech though, that would surely piss the coach off more. I got enough flak for calling a tech this year after a defender jumped to block a layup and then pulled the offensive player to the floor by his neck. I knew the ball had gone through before the contact occurred (video back me up) so I called a tech instead of an INT. Got my first-ever call from an assignor about the play.

Had the shooter returned to the floor already?

Sure had.

It is extremely late for a defender to be fouling a shooter when both the ball has cleared the basket and the shooter has returned to the floor. :eek:

Deserved whack!

The mechanics need to be changed so T gets this. C has moved his/her vision to the first two players on the lane to watch for rebounding fouls.

I actually appreciate this clarification, but I still have questions. If a defender violates, and does so enough to be considered a common foul, do I have the option of calling the foul over the violation? or do I have to go with the violation since it happened first? But then wouldn't my foul then potentially be a dead ball foul? Would it depend on if the FT is good or not?

Hypothetical: FT shooter releases, defender crosses the FT line (violation) and slams into the shooters knees (enough for a common foul) while the shot is still in the air.
A) shot misses
B) shot is made

If A, then should we just call the violation and award another FT, but if B call the foul since the violation is waived? If contact is significant enough, could you potentially have a violation AND a technical on a miss? Because I can't call a violation AND a common foul can I?

For you guys that don't think this is an issue, you must not do much girls varsity. Girls are bad about this. At least from where I am.

I was going over this scenario with some friends last night.

Remember, when the defense violates during a free throw the ball remains live. Play continues. When the player who violates continues into the shooter while the ball is live it is a common foul unless you deem it intentional/flagrant etc.

If the FT is missed the violation is penalized--replacement FT with no one on line. (if the violation and foul were on first shot of two shot foul then also shoot the second one with no one on line.) Then penalize the foul. If the FT was made the violation is not penalized. Penalize the foul. thx

This was our consensus.

You also have to adjust it based on whether the contact was before or after the ball goes through the basket. If it's after, the contact would be ignored unless it's I or F.

or, you can just assume that if the violation happened, then the contact happened before the ball went through.

That makes sense. Thanks.

Yes sir. Could possibly have nothing on the contact since it could be dead ball contact.

I cannot think of a legitimate reason why someone would be initiating contact 15' from the basket after the ball goes through the net.

It could feasibly happen, although not likely, most likely the contact would begin prior to the ball going through the basket.