New Youth Sports Law in Florida

[Rich]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Florida has had quite of few incidents of coaches/players attacking officials. I have no problem with them addressing legislation to clean up that environment.

I worked in a state once where a HS head coach ejection resulted in forfeit.

Nobody ever got ejected. If someone actually did, there'd be this huge rigamarole about "taking the game from the kids" and other crap like that.

Baseball's a different beast -- I've only had 2 coach ejections in 28 years in basketball (none since 1995) and none in football, but it's not unusual to have one in a season of HS baseball. When you allow coaches to work on the field and then come onto the field and argue calls, it leads to situations where the only practical recourse is making them go sit on the bus.

Laws like this tie the hands of the official. Nobody wants to see a coach lose their job over a single ejection.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Rich

I worked in a state once where a HS head coach ejection resulted in forfeit.

Nobody ever got ejected. If someone actually did, there'd be this huge rigamarole about "taking the game from the kids" and other crap like that.

Baseball's a different beast -- I've only had 2 coach ejections in 28 years in basketball (none since 1995) and none in football, but it's not unusual to have one in a season of HS baseball. When you allow coaches to work on the field and then come onto the field and argue calls, it leads to situations where the only practical recourse is making them go sit on the bus.

Laws like this tie the hands of the official. Nobody wants to see a coach lose their job over a single ejection.

The law would apply only for 12 and under sports leagues, so job security wouldn't really be an issue. It would only take a couple of officials with nutz to get the message across.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

The law would apply only for 12 and under sports leagues, so job security wouldn't really be an issue. It would only take a couple of officials with nutz to get the message across.

And how many of those officials would effectively be blackballed from working those leagues / games?

When I moved to Wisconsin, I looked for some youth football to work. Found what I thought was a good program. Coaches on the field during play at the younger levels. After 3 weeks of dealing with coaches who would try to get in your face and argue in the middle of the field, the league organizer said they're hiring other people going forward "because the coaches don't like that you won't let them yell at you on the field."

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Rich

And how many of those officials would effectively be blackballed from working those leagues / games?

I can't speculate on that. But I would assume that the leagues would not do such unless those administrators like chaos in their leagues.

[BatteryPowered]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I can't speculate on that. But I would assume that the leagues would not do such unless those administrators like chaos in their leagues.

Just my opinion, but I think that is a bad assumption.

Let's be honest, leagues are a source of revenue for an organization. You really think a business is going to keep using a particular vendor (official) and ignore the outrage of their customer (parents) when an equally...if not more...qualified vendor is available?

I ask because the first time a coach and official are having a particularly bad day at the same time and a coach is tossed and suspended I can see the brown stuff hitting the fan. Parents will be screaming because Little Johnny cannot be coached by their real coach. I mean, come on...everyone can see that he has the skills and ability to be the next King James.

[scrounge]

I don't think this is a matter for government. It's not about safety or punishment for violating the health or rights of others, like increased penalties on assaults. This should be under the authority of the leagues, not the state.

Plus, this particular bill is completely toothless and likely meaningless in practical effect. It does indeed ban an ejected coach for the season. However, it also says that each league must set up a procedure of 'due process' to allow an ejection to be appealed, which if successful would result in immediate reinstatement. There is no definition of that due process or any penalties for violation or anything. Waste of time.

So if a league is diligent and serious about sportsmanship, they likely don't need this blunt instrument. And if they're not, they'll just have a kangaroo court to rubber stamp appeals and achieve nothing in reality.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bil...ext/Filed/HTML

[jpgc99]

Originally Posted by scrounge

I don't think this is a matter for government. It's not about safety or punishment for violating the health or rights of others, like increased penalties on assaults. This should be under the authority of the leagues, not the state.

Plus, this particular bill is completely toothless and likely meaningless in practical effect. It does indeed ban an ejected coach for the season. However, it also says that each league must set up a procedure of 'due process' to allow an ejection to be appealed, which if successful would result in immediate reinstatement. There is no definition of that due process or any penalties for violation or anything. Waste of time.

So if a league is diligent and serious about sportsmanship, they likely don't need this blunt instrument. And if they're not, they'll just have a kangaroo court to rubber stamp appeals and achieve nothing in reality.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bil...ext/Filed/HTML

I agree with this. I also do not work any youth events anymore. I realize not everyone can do that, but even when I did work youth games I only worked for organizations that supported officials. Sometimes we lose sight of the fact we are independent contractors.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BatteryPowered

I ask because the first time a coach and official are having a particularly bad day at the same time and a coach is tossed and suspended I can see the brown stuff hitting the fan. Parents will be screaming because Little Johnny cannot be coached by their real coach. I mean, come on...everyone can see that he has the skills and ability to be the next King James.

I wouldn't even put this partly on the official. Even officials who are having a bad day manage to not toss coaches unless the coach is acting like a fool. The great thing is, there's always the first T as a warning.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I can't speculate on that. But I would assume that the leagues would not do such unless those administrators like chaos in their leagues.

You're kidding, right? There are stories all the times of leagues and tournaments who get rid of officials or simply stop using them because the officials TCB and don't bend over backwards to please the "customer." I posted one above. That's not the only time that's happened to me in 28 years, either.

Difference between me and other officials is that I don't really care -- I don't really need to work stuff like this and do it mainly to tune up for camps or for some pocket money to take on vacations. I'll TCB. Those that use this money to pay the bills quickly learn to get walked on so they keep getting the work.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Rich

You're kidding, right? There are stories all the times of leagues and tournaments who get rid of officials or simply stop using them because the officials TCB and don't bend over backwards to please the "customer." I posted one above. That's not the only time that's happened to me in 28 years, either.

Difference between me and other officials is that I don't really care -- I don't really need to work stuff like this and do it mainly to tune up for camps or for some pocket money to take on vacations. I'll TCB. Those that use this money to pay the bills quickly learn to get walked on so they keep getting the work.

Guess it is not an issue around these parts because I've never once considered something like that happening. There a lot of parents who sit in silence but I very happy their jack-wagon coach gets tossed from a game.

What I do know is that I've read quite a few stories of officials getting assaulted in Florida. Maybe this isn't the proper execution to address the lack of civility in sports leagues in that state, but apparently it is bad enough to catch the attention of some people of power.

[Mark Padgett]

In all the years I was associated with our local kids rec league, our policy was that if a coach was ejected, he or she had to appear before the executive committee of the Board of Directors before he or she could continue to coach. If they did not agree to appear, they were done coaching (either head or assistant) "forever", even if they had a younger kid who was coming up in the ranks. If they appeared, there was still the possibility they would be barred, but that was rare. Sometimes the Board committee would suspend them for a game or two but they usually straightened themselves out pretty quick. We had to keep in mind that all our coaches were volunteers and we really didn't want to lose them.

There was one coach who slapped a player (5th grade boy) during a timeout for "not paying attention". He thought it was OK to slap him because the kid was his son. We kicked this jerk out for life.

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

What I do know is that I've read quite a few stories of officials getting assaulted in Florida. Maybe this isn't the proper execution to address the lack of civility in sports leagues in that state, but apparently it is bad enough to catch the attention of some people of power.

I swear the heat cooks people's brains down here. The assault cases I've heard of tend to occur in youth football and soccer. There's no shortage lunatic parents in AAU basketball but I've not heard of much in the way of physical confrontation...at least in my neck of the woods. It is a big state though.

The person who sponsored the bill witnessed the bad behavior at his daughter's softball game (he's a coach). He's a state senator from South FL. (Broward County). I applaud the effort...but this measure seems broad, non-specific and unenforceable.

[jpgc99]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

The law would apply only for 12 and under sports leagues, so job security wouldn't really be an issue. It would only take a couple of officials with nutz to get the message across.

I haven't umpired youth baseball in several years - and haven't done any baseball for a few years now - but I would volunteer to fly myself to Florida and take care of business. Tell me where to sign up.