2014 Unannounced Changes? (e.g. Casebook 4.14.1 Sit. D)

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

For those who are interested, this is the (edited) NCAAW case play for the NFHS situation detailed above:

A.R. 65. A5 is fouled during an unsuccessful try for goal. As A5 goes to the free-throw line, A5 is assessed an unsportsmanlike technical foul, which is A5’s fifth and disqualifying foul. The scorer...does not inform the official that A5 has been disqualified until after A5 attempts the free throws.

RULING: Since A5 and A5’s coach were not notified of the disqualification until after A5’s free throws, the result of A5’s free throws shall stand. (Rule 4-12.4, 8-3.2.c, 2-9.4 and 4-27.1.e)

Thanks. Apparently I did not recall correctly.

Now that you posted it, I seem to remember (but we've seen how reliable that is) that this case was put in a few years ago -- and I agree with the case.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

For those who are interested, this is the (edited) NCAAW case play for the NFHS situation detailed above:

A.R. 65. A5 is fouled during an unsuccessful try for goal. As A5 goes to the free-throw line, A5 is assessed an unsportsmanlike technical foul, which is A5’s fifth and disqualifying foul. The scorer...does not inform the official that A5 has been disqualified until after A5 attempts the free throws.

RULING: Since A5 and A5’s coach were not notified of the disqualification until after A5’s free throws, the result of A5’s free throws shall stand. (Rule 4-12.4, 8-3.2.c, 2-9.4 and 4-27.1.e)

JMF:

I agree with NCAA Women's Ruling but what year is that ruling from?

MTD, Sr.

P.S. Loss last night for you.

[APG]

Moved posts discussing this casebook play to this thread

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

JMF:

I agree with NCAA Women's Ruling but what year is that ruling from?

MTD, Sr.

P.S. Loss last night for you.

MTDS -

All I know is it's in this year's case book I can't remember when the change took place. And, unfortunately, I don't have an attic

As for the p.s., yeah, well...

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

JMF:

I agree with NCAA Women's Ruling but what year is that ruling from?

MTD, Sr.

P.S. Loss last night for you.

I think it first appears in the 2002 book.

And, here's a NFHS 2000-01 Interp:

SITUATION 4: A1 is fouled by B2 and is awarded two free throws. The foul is B2’s fifth foul. The trail official reports the fifth foul to Team B’s coach. Before a substitute is made, the lead official incorrectly permits A1 to attempt the first free throw. The trail official realizes the error and huddles with the lead official. RULING: The result of the first attempt shall stand. Team B’s head coach shall be notified of B2’s disqualification. Once B2 has been replaced, A1 shall attempt the second free throw. COMMENT: This is an official’s error and not a correctable error situation according to Rule 2-10. (10-6 Pen; 2-8-3; 10-5-1d)

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Oh, about 10 years ago (I don't know that it was a change)

Bob:

You mean you don't want to climb in my attic with me and go through 43 years of H.S. and college rules books and casebooks with me.

MTD, Sr.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by APG

Thoughts on this new casebook play?

*4.14.1 SITUATION D:

A1 is fouled by B1 while Team A is in double bonus. In frustration, A1 pushes B1 after the ball becomes dead. A1 is assessed a technical foul. A1 successfully makes both free throws for the personal foul assessed to B1. B3 is ready to attempt the free throw for the technical foul by A1. The official scorer notifies the officials that the technical foul on A1 was his/her fifth.

RULING: Officials notify the Team A coach and A1 of the disqualification and allow a substitute for A1. A correctable error has occurred by allowing the wrong player (A1) to attempt the free throws for the personal foul and has been discovered within the timeframe to correct. The free throws by A1 are cancelled and A1’s substitute shall attempt the free throws for the personal foul against A1 followed by the attempts by Team B for the technical foul. (2-10-1c, 4-14-1)

I think this falls into the category of "unannounced change".

[PG_Ref]

Originally Posted by APG

Thoughts on this new casebook play?

*4.14.1 SITUATION D:

A1 is fouled by B1 while Team A is in double bonus. In frustration, A1 pushes B1 after the ball becomes dead. A1 is assessed a technical foul. A1 successfully makes both free throws for the personal foul assessed to B1. B3 is ready to attempt the free throw for the technical foul by A1. The official scorer notifies the officials that the technical foul on A1 was his/her fifth.

RULING: Officials notify the Team A coach and A1 of the disqualification and allow a substitute for A1. A correctable error has occurred by allowing the wrong player (A1) to attempt the free throws for the personal foul and has been discovered within the timeframe to correct. The free throws by A1 are cancelled and A1’s substitute shall attempt the free throws for the personal foul against A1 followed by the attempts by Team B for the technical foul. (2-10-1c, 4-14-1)

This ruling has been taken to NFHS for clarification. They are supposedly going to issue a correction along with a few other seemingly contradictions between rule and caseplay. Hopefully they will correct and not confuse further.