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-   -   Kentucky vs. Wichita State Throw-In Violation (Video) (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/97593-kentucky-vs-wichita-state-throw-violation-video.html)

BillyMac Wed Mar 26, 2014 06:45pm

No Soup For You ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 929141)
"You cannot move" (:D)

I'm not taking the bait.

(And no 10% discount for you when I go on my article signing tour.)

AremRed Wed Mar 26, 2014 06:47pm

I usually specify either "spot throw" or "you can run the end line" for end line throw-ins only. For sideline throw-ins the players should always know it is a spot throw. I haven't heard a credible reason why I shouldn't. What you call "coaching" I, and many others call "preventative officiating".

Rob1968 Wed Mar 26, 2014 06:53pm

NFHS Officials Manual 3.2.2 Throw-ins:
C End Line 5. When the clock is stopped, use the proper verbal and visual signal to indicate whether a spot throw-in or running the end line privileges are in effect.

JRutledge Wed Mar 26, 2014 06:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 929145)
I'm not taking the bait.

(And no 10% discount for you when I go on my article signing tour.)

Don't worry, I was not going to buy it anyway. Just like I am not buying any IAABO books either.

Peace

eyezen Wed Mar 26, 2014 07:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 929133)

Was this coming out of a timeout? Perhaps some preventative officiating could have prevented this?

From this video there is no way to determine wether he did or did not indicate a spot throw in.

APG Wed Mar 26, 2014 09:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 929133)

Was this coming out of a timeout? Perhaps some preventative officiating could have prevented this?

Spot throw-in after a charge was called on a fastbreak.

Raymond Thu Mar 27, 2014 07:11am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob1968 (Post 929142)
I agree - coming out of the time-out: verify, even from a distance, with my partners what kind - (spot or run the endline) and where is the throw-in. It would save the crew from a possibly embarrassing situation.

I announce so everyone can hear whether it is a spot or "running" throw-in. The defense is supposed to be informed just like the offense is.

Nevadaref Thu Mar 27, 2014 07:43am

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 929146)
I usually specify either "spot throw" or "you can run the end line" for end line throw-ins only. For sideline throw-ins the players should always know it is a spot throw. I haven't heard a credible reason why I shouldn't. What you call "coaching" I, and many others call "preventative officiating".

Seems that we were on different wave-lengths.
Apparently, what you call "preventative officiating" I call proper mechanics.
I have no issue with the official signaling something which he should, however it seemed that you were advocating that the official should go out of his way to tell the player what he may or may not doing in this situation.
There is a line between an official properly giving information to the players and an official providing extra instruction which benefits one team.

Adam Thu Mar 27, 2014 08:40am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 929214)
I announce so everyone can hear whether it is a spot or "running" throw-in. The defense is supposed to be informed just like the offense is.

I honestly say it just loud enough for those in the vicinity to hear, along with a visual signal. I'm not yelling it loud enough for the bigs on the other end to hear it. But I agree, I wait until both sides are out of the TO before saying it, unless of course the D is a bit late to the party.

Adam Thu Mar 27, 2014 08:41am

Quote:

Originally Posted by APG (Post 929168)
Spot throw-in after a charge was called on a fastbreak.

Yep, there was no TO involved (IIRC).

ballgame99 Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:18am

I was so confused when i saw this live. There must have been some sort of break because it didn't even dawn on me this was a spot throw in.

AremRed Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:04am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 929218)
Apparently, what you call "preventative officiating" I call proper mechanics.

Is there a section in the mechanics manual that says: "made sure to not over-communicate, you might be giving one team an unfair advantage" or "only follow these proper mechanics, nothing more, nothing less"?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 929218)
There is a line between an official properly giving information to the players and an official providing extra instruction which benefits one team.

If I do it for every throw, doesn't it benefit both teams?

Adam Thu Mar 27, 2014 02:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 929263)
Is there a section in the mechanics manual that says: "made sure to not over-communicate, you might be giving one team an unfair advantage" or "only follow these proper mechanics, nothing more, nothing less"?



If I do it for every throw, doesn't it benefit both teams?

Nevadaref thought you meant something along the lines of "Jimmy, this is a spot throw in. Remember, that means you can't go too far to either your left or your right. You don't have to keep a pivot foot or anything, but your space is three feet wide."

Now, for most of me, it's "13, here's your spot." I think the problem was with the term "preventative officiating" when used to (apparently) indicate following the proper mechanics for the situation. Yes, in this case, the mechanic is preventive, but, it isn't what is generally referred to (around her) as "preventive officiating."

We get easily hung up on terms around here.

AremRed Thu Mar 27, 2014 03:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 929317)
Nevadaref thought you meant something along the lines of "Jimmy, this is a spot throw in. Remember, that means you can't go too far to either your left or your right. You don't have to keep a pivot foot or anything, but your space is three feet wide."

Given that I said exactly what I do (see below), I don't think Nevadaref misunderstood me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 929146)
I usually specify either "spot throw" or "you can run the end line" for end line throw-ins only. For sideline throw-ins the players should always know it is a spot throw.



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