Throw in issues HS Rules

[HokiePaul]

Originally Posted by Rob1968

Try 9-2-2, and Case Book 9.2.2 A (a) and (b), which have to do with (The ball shall be passed directly into the court from out-of-bounds...).

Thanks. And the case 9.2.2 D seems to me to support the ruling that the actions in the OP 3a are legal. "Ruling: A player may bounce the ball on the out-of-bounds area prior to making a throw-in".

It specifically mentions "out-of-bounds area" instead of "floor" so I'm keeping my 5 second count as the player bounces the ball off of the wall to themselves out of bounds.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by HokiePaul

Thanks. And the case 9.2.2 D seems to me to support the ruling that the actions in the OP 3a are legal. "Ruling: A player may bounce the ball on the out-of-bounds area prior to making a throw-in".

It specifically mentions "out-of-bounds area" instead of "floor" so I'm keeping my 5 second count as the player bounces the ball off of the wall to themselves out of bounds.

While it does say area, I think it would be pretty safe to assume they really meant area of the floor.

That said, I'm also OK with being liberal with it and ruling it to not be a violation. In the spirit of this rule, it doesn't really match the violations on the throwin going directly OOB because the thrower was just bouncing it to himself/herself (like dribble but not technically a dribble). They gain absolutely nothing by doing so...and probably just waste time that could have been used for the throwin.

As for situation #1, I've got a violation as soon as it passed the plane of the sideline. The throwin can only be made along the endline, not the endline extended, and the ball is no longer along the endline but is in an OOB area where no thowin can be made.

[HokiePaul]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

As for situation #1, I've got a violation as soon as it passed the plane of the sideline. The throwin can only be made along the endline, not the endline extended, and the ball is no longer along the endline but is in an OOB area where no thowin can be made.

Interesting thought -- although technically the throwin hasn't been "made" yet and it still could be made along the endline if recovered quickly enough.

Would anyone else call a violation immediately if a player moved endline "extended" or would the call be made only if the ball was released on a throwin from this position. Since there is no line, it would have to be a judgement call as to whether or not the thrower crossed the sideline plane. Also, depending on where you positioned (and whether it is 2 or 3 man), this sideline call might be your partners line/call.

[frezer11]

Originally Posted by Altor

Would you also allow them to bounce it off the back of the backboard?

Originally Posted by HokiePaul

Not really a good comparison to the play in question.

Initially I thought, "What is Hokie talking about, I think that's a great comparison," but as I think about it, you're right, the backboard is past the throw in plane. Which makes me think of this, what if teammates out of bound along the end line pass the ball, and it hits the basket support on the out of bounds side of the line? Same as hititng the wall behind the basket?

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by frezer11

what if teammates out of bounds along the end line pass the ball, and it hits the basket support on the out of bounds side of the line? Same as hititng the wall behind the basket?

NFHS 7-1-2a...The ball is out of bounds when it touches...:

3. The supports or back of the backboard.
4. The ceiling, overhead equipment or supports

So it would appear no violation if it's following made/awarded FG or FT. Of course you’ll probably end up with a five-second violation since the ball will most likely ricochet somewhere and the players won’t be able to recover it in time.

[frezer11]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

NFHS 7-1-2a...The ball is out of bounds when it touches...:

3. The supports or back of the backboard.
4. The ceiling, overhead equipment or supports

So it would appear no violation if it's following made/awarded FG or FT. Of course you’ll probably end up with a five-second violation since the ball will most likely ricochet somewhere and the players won’t be able to recover it in time.

Agree with the rule (not that there's anything to agree with, it's the rule!), but does that mean your interpretation is that the inbounds pass can hit the back of the backboard, and bounce back to the thrower, and he can still inbound it with no violation? Clearly not, so is there a difference between hitting the back of the backboard (an area defined as out of bounds), or hitting the support outside the boundary line (an area also defined as out of bounds)? I'm actually thinking that hitting that support, again as long as it is outside the boundary line, is legal, but admittedly, not totally sure on this one.

[HokiePaul]

Originally Posted by frezer11

... is there a difference between hitting the back of the backboard (an area defined as out of bounds), or hitting the support outside the boundary line (an area also defined as out of bounds)? I'm actually thinking that hitting that support, again as long as it is outside the boundary line, is legal, but admittedly, not totally sure on this one.

It is a weird situation. Most high schools in my area have the supports that come down from the ceiling/upper wall so it would take a little bit of effort to hit the supports on the out of bounds side of the line. If it were one of the baskets where there is a support base on the ground in the out of bounds area, I feel like it would be a different situation (almost unavoidable at times to not bump into the base). I am not totally sure either.

[Altor]

Originally Posted by HokiePaul

It specifically mentions "out-of-bounds area" instead of "floor" so I'm keeping my 5 second count as the player bounces the ball off of the wall to themselves out of bounds.

Would you also allow them to bounce it off the back of the backboard?

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by Altor

Would you also allow them to bounce it off the back of the backboard?

Sure. Once. Then the ball would go to the other team due to the violation.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

Sure. Once. Then the ball would go to the other team due to the violation.

+10

MTD, Sr.

[HokiePaul]

Originally Posted by Altor

Would you also allow them to bounce it off the back of the backboard?

Not really a good comparison to the play in question.

I see it more like the thrower backing up and touching the wall behind them. Whether the player touches the wall or the ball touches the wall in the out of bounds area, there is no depth restriction on the throw in so I'm not seeing a rule being violated in this specific instance.