NCAA proposed rule change...Separate yet separate

[JetMetFan]

Create separate rules book for men and women.

To separate the printing of the NCAA Men’s and Women’s Basketball Rules Books, with the following mandates:
1. That both committees meet jointly and collaborate on an annual basis;
2. That both committees will collaborate on the development of rules language where rules are identical;
3. That rules changes that impact common issues (e.g., facility issues, court markings, etc.) be discussed and every effort is made to have common rules in these areas;
4. That both secretary-rules editors will collaborate on rules book preparation and interpretations.

Rationale: Ease of understanding rules that only apply to the users.

[JetMetFan]

We were told today (Tuesday) it was the men pushing for this change.

[bob jenkins]

How hard is it to skip the rules that don't apply to one gender or the other?

I'd like to see them make the rules "more common" and splitting the books will lead to greater differences despite the four "mandates"

[JRutledge]

I think it would be a good change. Women's basketball tries to be so different I am really tired of having to figure out what they do differently so it does not spill into the Men's game. Separate would be best as the Women's side is so bent on being different then what usually happens at other level. Since the Women's side wants to be different, let them produce their own book just like it is with mechanics.

Peace

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I think it would be a good change. Women's basketball tries to be so different I am really tired of having to figure out what they do differently so it does not spill into the Men's game. Separate would be best as the Women's side is so bent on being different then what usually happens at other level. Since the Women's side wants to be different, let them produce their own book just like it is with mechanics.

Peace

Right, we're so different. Which is why NCAAM is the only rule set that doesn't have an airborne shooter rule on offensive fouls. Or why NCAAM has Class A and Class B technical fouls while the rest of the world...doesn't.

As I pointed out, it's the men's rules committee that pushed for this one.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

Right, we're so different. Which is why NCAAM is the only rule set that doesn't have an airborne shooter rule on offensive fouls. Or why NCAAM has Class A and Class B technical fouls while the rest of the world...doesn't.

As I pointed out, it's the men's rules committee that pushed for this one.

There is an airborne shooter rule, it just does not apply to a PC foul. But that is so rare it never happens. I think once in my 8 or 9 college year career have I ever had to even rule on such a play. Also Class A and Class B Technicals are really about terminology, the rule is basically the same when it comes to other levels for the most part.

Not having a 10 second rule violation and no closely guarded unless a ball handler is holding the ball is IMO very different and likely to happen more often. And then when they consider the 10 second rule they completely have to be different to start the count.

And I understand why they pushed for this separation, that is why I agree with that proposal.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

... Consider the 10 second rule, they completely have to be different to start the count.

Stupid monkeys.

[rockyroad]

Thanks for posting this stuff, JMF. Keep the info coming - you seem to have an "in" when it comes to getting this info.

As for the NCAAW "having to be different", just consider the source and ignore the comments. Most people understand that a lot of the changes the NCAAW side make come down from NBA/WNBA studies and changes.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Thanks for posting this stuff, JMF. Keep the info coming - you seem to have an "in" when it comes to getting this info.

As for the NCAAW "having to be different", just consider the source and ignore the comments. Most people understand that a lot of the changes the NCAAW side make come down from NBA/WNBA studies and changes.

No worries on my end. Some folks don't like the NCAAW game and that's all good. As you pointed out, when it comes to mechanics we're actually the ones who move to follow the pros a bit sooner (see "officials going tableside after calling a foul"). The only thing we were slow on was the ten-second count and I don't know how much of a difference it's going to make. Realistically, how many ten-second violations are called in NCAAM? Getting two in the same NCAA tourney game this season may have been the first two I've seen in years.

Regarding when we start the shot-clock period following a throw-in (when the ball is touched as opposed to when the offense controls it), that would be the NBA rule as well...

NBA Rule 7-2b
On a throw-in, the 24-second clock shall start when the ball is legally touched on the court by a player.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

... Realistically, how many ten-second violations are called in NCAAM? Getting two in the same NCAA tourney game this season may have been the first two I've seen in years.
...

I had 2 this season on back-to-back possessions by one team, and this was a college game.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

No worries on my end. Some folks don't like the NCAAW game and that's all good. As you pointed out, when it comes to mechanics we're actually the ones who move to follow the pros a bit sooner (see "officials going tableside after calling a foul"). The only thing we were slow on was the ten-second count and I don't know how much of a difference it's going to make. Realistically, how many ten-second violations are called in NCAAM? Getting two in the same NCAA tourney game this season may have been the first two I've seen in years.

I have had 3 or 4 in a season in college games. Some teams put full court pressure can cause this violation like other violations. And with these kinds of situations I do not see why it is a big deal to have separate rules. They have separate committees, why is it a big deal to have separate rulebooks? There are separate CCA Manuals.

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

Regarding when we start the shot-clock period following a throw-in (when the ball is touched as opposed to when the offense controls it), that would be the NBA rule as well...

Good for the NBA. College players are not NBA players. Just like college players should not play under many NFL rules as well. Then again that is a personal opinion.

Peace

[APG]

Umm...the shot clock starts the same in NCAA and NBA...as soon as the ball is legally touched from a throw-in. I believe y'all are talking about when a backcourt count begins.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by APG

Umm...the shot clock starts the same in NCAA and NBA...as soon as the ball is legally touched from a throw-in. I believe y'all are talking about when a backcourt count begins.

I am, but this just goes to show why there needs to be separate rulebooks.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I am, but this just goes to show why there needs to be separate rulebooks.

Peace

No, this just goes to show why the different levels need to unify on rules that really have no good reason to be different.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

No, this just goes to show why the different levels need to unify on rules that really have no good reason to be different.

I disagree and that is not going to happen either. That is not the case in any sport when you separate youth, to college, to the pros. And certainly not going to happen when each has a different committee.

Peace