Gonzaga / Southern video (Added)

[LeeBallanfant]

It would have been interesting to see what would have happened had Ted Valentine instead of being center had been lead and was waved off by the trail.

[just another ref]

Could someone post the NCAA rule regarding a blarge?

[icallfouls]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Could someone post the NCAA rule regarding a blarge?

It was a memo/directive. If both officials give a preliminary signal, then both calls are taken to the bench and enforced. It is a common discussion the pre-games I have been part of to make sure that both officials are slow to show, rather than banging both right away.

The other thing from the video. Both officials go with two hands up, but only one gives a preliminary. The T basically gives the L a "no-no, I got this!" two handed stop sign. They made eye contact and the L gave the call to the T or the T took it, whatever you prefer.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by icallfouls

It was a memo/directive. If both officials give a preliminary signal, then both calls are taken to the bench and enforced.

Okay, thanks. So, like NFHS, there is nothing in the books to this effect. But, unlike NCAA, NFHS has no such memo/directive. Interesting.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Okay, thanks. So, like NFHS, there is nothing in the books to this effect. But, unlike NCAA, NFHS has no such memo/directive. Interesting.

The NFHS case play is clear, but you know that. You're the only one who suggests otherwise, but you know that. Let's stay on topic here.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by icallfouls

It was a memo/directive. If both officials give a preliminary signal, then both calls are taken to the bench and enforced. It is a common discussion the pre-games I have been part of to make sure that both officials are slow to show, rather than banging both right away.

The other thing from the video. Both officials go with two hands up, but only one gives a preliminary. The T basically gives the L a "no-no, I got this!" two handed stop sign. They made eye contact and the L gave the call to the T or the T took it, whatever you prefer.

I hope you're joking that only one gave a prelim. Sure, the lead didn't "finish" it, but he gave enough of it for everyone to know what he had. If the signal is received, that means it was sent. He showed what he had.

And, you know there is no way he was going from that position to a charge....you do that same thing and I've never seen you go to a charge from there.

One officials two hands up were actually in the process of making a block signal. The other other officials hands were not yet showing anything. At that point, the call was a block by one and nothing by the other. The trail then still came in, told him he was wrong, then made a contradictory signal....overruling him improperly. Was the ultimate call right? Sure. But the trail trampled all over his partner on that one.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by icallfouls

He did not signal anything other than two hands in the air, which could have been a held ball for that matter.

You know better than to believe that. It is, at best, dishonest to say the lead hadn't called a block.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

You know better than to believe that. It is, at best, dishonest to say the lead hadn't called a block.

Well he did not actually signal anything. It might have been obvious what he was going to signal by his body language, but for all of our purposes, he never signaled. He was stopped from signaling by his partner.

Peace

[Nikki]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Well he did not actually signal anything. It might have been obvious what he was going to signal by his body language, but for all of our purposes, he never signaled. He was stopped from signaling by his partner.

+100

There was no preliminary signal made by either official. No matter what anyone thinks about the L going up with both hands - he had not yet made the signal for a block, no matter what he was GOING TO do.

[icallfouls]

I'll bet when the L looks at the video, he'll be pretty happy that he didn't give a preliminary, and his partner called him off.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Adam

The NFHS case play is clear, but you know that. You're the only one who suggests otherwise, but you know that. Let's stay on topic here.

Here's the interesting part. If I understand correctly, this NCAA memo specifies that opposing prelims=blarge. (must report both) But this starts a whole new debate. When is a signal a signal? Like in the OP. Yeah, it's pretty obvious that the lead had a block. Is the crew in trouble now for not reporting both?

[cmb]

I can't believe anyone could seriously think the L didn't give a signal. He blows his whistle and is sliding/hopping to his side while holding two fists high in the air. Let's not kid anyone here. That's enough for everyone to know he's calling a block.

Question for those trying to tell us the L didn't actually signal: in your opinion, at what point is the block signal actually made? Is it once the fists start to come down? When they actually hit the hips? Somewhere in between??

I agree with Camron. The signal was received, which means it was sent.

[icallfouls]

Originally Posted by cmb

I can't believe anyone could seriously think the L didn't give a signal. He blows his whistle and is sliding/hopping to his side while holding two fists high in the air. Let's not kid anyone here. That's enough for everyone to know he's calling a block.

Question for those trying to tell us the L didn't actually signal: in your opinion, at what point is the block signal actually made? Is it once the fists start to come down? When they actually hit the hips? Somewhere in between??

I agree with Camron. The signal was received, which means it was sent.

I have done the two hands up thing and then signaled a charge, I processed for a moment and made the correct call. It was never a block. The extra moment before banging my hips was enough for me to get it right.

The crowd (about 3500) didn't gasp and start screaming for what they thought I was going to call.

The only ones who knew it were my referee buddies, who texted me at halftime and said "nice save."

B/C's are usually bang-bang big moment plays, it happens.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by icallfouls

I have done the two hands up thing and then signaled a charge, I processed for a moment and made the correct call. It was never a block. The extra moment before banging my hips was enough for me to get it right.

And we've all done things when we meant to do something else. Which is one great reason why being required to ultimately do anything because of a signal is, how can I put this delicately, incredibly stupid.

[icallfouls]

Originally Posted by just another ref

And we've all done things when we meant to do something else. Which is one great reason why being required to ultimately do anything because of a signal is, how can I put this delicately, incredibly stupid.

Sounds like we are in agreement