Question from a Partner (after a T)

[twocentsworth]

neither comment/response calls for a T in my book.

[maven]

Complaining about the foul count: unless he's screaming like a banshee no T, tell him to knock it off (IOW, it does need to be addressed).

Follow up action with another official: that's nothing. Ever.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Moosie74

Boys JV game the other night. Late in the 2nd quarter partner calls a foul on A1. A1 comments rather loudly that's "7-1 (fouls) against us" Partner issues a technical.

Late in the 3rd quarter A1 is dribbling and is given a two hand push by B1. I call the foul on B1, A1 says to me in a conversational tone, "thank you sir" and goes off to the line for the shots.

My partner asks me at the quarter break what A1 said to me, I repeated his comment. Partner says no, "you've got to call the technical there, he was clearly trying to show me up".

I can't see any reason why I would issue a technical in that scenario based on a calm, conversational comment is worthy of any action on my part.

There are many other ways the player could have reacted but he just said that and went off to play the game.

Is there something I missed here?

When the topic of x-y fouls comes up (x >> y), I try to give a warning before the T. If the comment is quiet, I'll often give a reminder before the warning. But if it's loud as you mentioned, then I judge the game situation. It's possible I'll go straight to a T in this case.

As for the other case where your P believes a T is the correct call, I would politely tell him that this is not even close to a T in my game.

So no, you did not miss anything.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

When the topic of x-y fouls comes up (x >> y), I try to give a warning before the T. If the comment is quiet, I'll often give a reminder before the warning. But if it's loud as you mentioned, then I judge the game situation. It's possible I'll go straight to a T in this case.

I give coaches more leeway and warning in this case.

[icallfouls]

Not sure how loud this was, so it is hard to say if it was TF worthy, but I think the way we do it at the college level is a pretty good way to handle this. We are supposed to give a warning, then if it happens again, it is penalized. I realize that the directive is meant to apply to coaches, but I think it is equally effective for players.

As far as dealing with the player, I think having a heightened awareness isn't always a bad thing. For me, the player is right up against the line when making that statement. A simple warning usually is enough to get the player to refocus.

I have a friend who is a bit old school but believes in the silent TF. A player that is causing problems might find themselves, by the letter of the law, committing a foul or a violation on the next possession or two. Not saying it is what I do, but I have seen this in action. It is effective.

Officials need to understand that players and coaches are more emotional about the outcome on every play. Sure if a player/coach crosses the line, we must deal with it. I just think we need to consider the perspective of players and coaches.

[egj13]

Once again surprised at how many would T-up for the original foul count comment. Did he throw his hands up or something when he said it? Its a JV contest for one, he wasn't lying for two...I wouldn't have given a T but probably a look like "no more kid"

[Adam]

Originally Posted by egj13

Once again surprised at how many would T-up for the original foul count comment. Did he throw his hands up or something when he said it? Its a JV contest for one, he wasn't lying for two...I wouldn't have given a T but probably a look like "no more kid"

And if he does it again? Another stern look? Yelling about the foul count gets the coach a warning. Yelling about a missed foul gets the coach a warning. Yelling about missed traveling, same warning. (Note, one warning total). Yelling at the refs from a player? No warning.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by egj13

Its a JV contest for one..."

Which is exactly why he needed to be rung up. He needs to keep himself quiet and play. My guess is the "Thank you, Sir" comment was the result of his coach chewing him out at some point after the T.