Clock malfunction

[letemplay]

Following a time out and with 15 seconds left in game, Team B holds a one point lead and the ball for a throw in from endline opposite their basket. After the successful inbounds pass, B is attempting to advance the ball vs Team A pressure. After a few passes, someone from the sideline area is heard yelling "start the clock" or "the clock didn't start". Trail, while reaching a count of 8, takes a quick peek and sees the clock is running, but only showing 14..turning to 13.. and realizes it probably did not get started properly. Should play be stopped and the clock reset at 7 seconds based on trails bc count? Should play be allowed to continue whereupon (possibly) A committs a foul and then the 7 second adjustment is made? If play is stopped immediately, B is disadvantaged for having to inbound again under pressure, but if not, A may have gotten a steal or a 10-sec count. What's the proper way to handle such a situation?

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by letemplay

Following a time out and with 15 seconds left in game, Team B holds a one point lead and the ball for a throw in from endline opposite their basket. After the successful inbounds pass, B is attempting to advance the ball vs Team A pressure. After a few passes, someone from the sideline area is heard yelling "start the clock" or "the clock didn't start". Trail, while reaching a count of 8, takes a quick peek and sees the clock is running, but only showing 14..turning to 13.. and realizes it probably did not get started properly. Should play be stopped and the clock reset at 7 seconds based on trails bc count? Should play be allowed to continue whereupon (possibly) A committs a foul and then the 7 second adjustment is made? If play is stopped immediately, B is disadvantaged for having to inbound again under pressure, but if not, A may have gotten a steal or a 10-sec count. What's the proper way to handle such a situation?

The non-administering official maybe could have taken a peak at the clock.

You should stop the clock, and award B a throw-in with 7 seconds on the clock. This is the least damage to the situation, imho.

I also believe that B should get only 2 seconds left to cross the division line, but I'm not certain this approach is supported anywhere.

Nothing good can come out of having nobody aware of how much time is really left.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

The non-administering official maybe could have taken a peak at the clock.

You should stop the clock, and award B a throw-in with 7 seconds on the clock. This is the least damage to the situation, imho.

I also believe that B should get only 2 seconds left to cross the division line, but I'm not certain this approach is supported anywhere.

Nothing good can come out of having nobody aware of how much time is really left.

If you stop the clock to fix the issue in the BC then the inbounding team gets a full 10 seconds. We do not suspend the BC count.

I would wait for the ball to make it to the FC before stopping play and fixing the clock based on my (T) count (15 - whatever count I had). It's not fair to the defense who could get a BC 10 second violation here to blow the play dead and start over.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by deecee

If you stop the clock to fix the issue in the BC then the inbounding team gets a full 10 seconds. We do not suspend the BC count.

I would wait for the ball to make it to the FC before stopping play and fixing the clock based on my (T) count (15 - whatever count I had). It's not fair to the defense who could get a BC 10 second violation here to blow the play dead and start over.

Ya, good compromise.

It won't be easy for many people, especially the coaches, to realize that waiting until the ball is in the FC is best thing all around. Multiple people will be screaming.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by letemplay

Following a time out and with 15 seconds left in game, Team B holds a one point lead and the ball for a throw in from endline opposite their basket. After the successful inbounds pass, B is attempting to advance the ball vs Team A pressure. After a few passes, someone from the sideline area is heard yelling "start the clock" or "the clock didn't start". Trail, while reaching a count of 8, takes a quick peek and sees the clock is running, but only showing 14..turning to 13.. and realizes it probably did not get started properly. Should play be stopped and the clock reset at 7 seconds based on trails bc count? Should play be allowed to continue whereupon (possibly) A committs a foul and then the 7 second adjustment is made? If play is stopped immediately, B is disadvantaged for having to inbound again under pressure, but if not, A may have gotten a steal or a 10-sec count. What's the proper way to handle such a situation?

If there is no imminent shot (and there probably isn't with a backcourt count), blow whistle to stop the game, set the clock to 7 based on the backccourt count. B's ball at the closest spot to where the ball was.

(note that "A" is traditionally used for the team with the ball, not "B").

DO NOT continue with an 8 second offset in your head if you see the clock start late. The players will be playing to what they see on the clock. If you let the clock run 7 more seconds (which would have been when it should have expired) and you blow the whistle and declare the game over, you're going to have a mess.

[PG_Ref]

Originally Posted by deecee

If you stop the clock to fix the issue in the BC then the inbounding team gets a full 10 seconds. We do not suspend the BC count.

I would wait for the ball to make it to the FC before stopping play and fixing the clock based on my (T) count (15 - whatever count I had). It's not fair to the defense who could get a BC 10 second violation here to blow the play dead and start over.

Around these parts, the rule is to stop play immediately and correct the time. Go to POI. Also, we'd catch hell for not noticing that the clock didn't start for 7 secs.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by PG_Ref

Around these parts, the rule is to stop play immediately and correct the time. Go to POI. Also, we'd catch hell for not noticing that the clock didn't start for 7 secs.

I don't disagree with this statement, in fact I generally agree. In the BC, unless my assignor instruct me to do it that way, I will hold off for the final 2 seconds until the ball has obtained FC status.

Let's say it's a tie game and could force a turnover and you do this, your are pretty much negating the effort of the defense. Either way, whether the clock starts or not, the team with the ball knows they have 10 seconds to make it and they know you have a count. The game clock running, or not running, doesn't change those facts.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by deecee

I don't disagree with this statement, in fact I generally agree. In the BC, unless my assignor instruct me to do it that way, I will hold off for the final 2 seconds until the ball has obtained FC status.

Let's say it's a tie game and could force a turnover and you do this, your are pretty much negating the effort of the defense. Either way, whether the clock starts or not, the team with the ball knows they have 10 seconds to make it and they know you have a count. The game clock running, or not running, doesn't change those facts.

But it's fair to expect that team can rely on the running clock to gauge how much time they have left.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

But it's fair to expect that team can rely on the running clock to gauge how much time they have left.

Absolutely. Here's why I look at this situation this way. The officials screwed up first and foremost by letting it get this far. Blowing the whistle you are negating the defensive effort. by not blowing the whistle you are showing an incorrect amount of time on the clock. Now if the game is out of hand and this possession doesn't matter then of course blow it dead and fix the issue.

My reasoning is for a game that is either tied or the team with the ball has the last possession and still has a chance at winning the game in their next possession.

If this were to happen say any other time of the game then blow it dead and fix the clock ASAP. apologize to defensive coach for the crew's lapse in clock management and move on quickly.

[letemplay]

[QUOTE=Camron Rust;861451]

(note that "A" is traditionally used for the team with the ball, not "B").



Good responses all here, thanks. Bottom line what most are saying, someone on crew (probably least of all the T) needs to be sure clock starts.
Cam, while realizing A is usually team with ball, I posed 'B' having it in this case with A being Home team and possibly benefitting from the extra time by the Home clock operator. Off top of my head, seems some casebook sitch's infer 'A' as Home...maybe not.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by letemplay

Good responses all here, thanks. Bottom line what most are saying, someone on crew (probably least of all the T) needs to be sure clock starts.
Cam, while realizing A is usually team with ball, I posed 'B' having it in this case with A being Home team and possibly benefitting from the extra time by the Home clock operator. Off top of my head, seems some casebook sitch's infer 'A' as Home...maybe not.

I can't think of any, unless home happened to be the team with the ball.

[APG]

If it's me and the count's already at 8, I'm not stopping play until there's a 10 second violation or the ball crosses into the frontcourt. As such, I agree with deecee's way of handling the play.