POI or AP?

Hugh Refner · #1 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 10:52am

NF rules. Double personal foul called on A1 and B1 at the same time. Do you go to POI or AP? Thanks.

APG · #2 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 10:55am

For all double fouls, you always go to the POI. It just happens that sometimes, the AP is the POI.

bainsey · #3 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 11:08am

POI. If there's no team control, AP.

Zoochy · #4 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 11:09am

The following case play best describes POI of Double fouls as well as location of administrating the Throw-in.

4.19.8 SITUATION E: A1 has control of the ball in Team A's frontcourt. Post
players A5 and B5 are pushing each other in an attempt to gain a more advantageous position on the block while (a) A1 is dribbling the ball; (b) the ball is in the air on a pass from A1 to A2; or (c) the ball is in the air on an unsuccessful try for goal by A1. An official calls a double personal foul on A5 and B5. RULING: In (a) and (b), Team A had control of the ball when the double foul occurred, and thus play will be resumed at the point of interruption. Team A will have a designated spot throw-in nearest the location where the ball was located when the double foul occurred. In (c), no team has control while a try for goal is in flight, and since the try was unsuccessful, there is no obvious point of interruption. Play will be resumed with an alternating possession throw-in nearest the location where the ball was located when the double foul occurred. Had the try been successful, the point of interruption would have been a throw-in for Team B from anywhere along the end line. (4-36; 6-4-3g; 7-5-3b)

APG · #5 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 11:16am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey

POI. If there's no team control, AP.

Correction, if there's no team control, and no goal, infraction, or end of period/half is involved.

bainsey · #6 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 11:37am

Quote:

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

Correction, if there's no team control, and no goal, infraction, or end of period/half is involved.

Right, but he's talking double personal fouls here. If a goal is involved, the double personal foul typically happened during the shot -- no team control. Your point on end of period is well taken: tweet, double foul, horn. I'm struggling to think of a scenario where a double foul would precede a violation.

APG · #7 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 11:42am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey

Right, but he's talking double personal fouls here. If a goal is involved, the double personal foul typically happened during the shot -- no team control. Your point on end of period is well taken: tweet, double foul, horn. I'm struggling to think of a scenario where a double foul would precede a violation.

Player jockeying for rebounding position...double foul while a try is in flight. Try goes in. You had a double foul with no team control, and according to your statement, we'd go to the AP, but there's a goal involved, therefore you wouldn't use the AP and the opposing team would have an unrestricted throw-in on the endline.

The problem with your statement is you'll have officials that would at times, erroneously give the ball back to the team that just made a basket or force a change of the AP when it's not warranted, if they followed the rule you didn't fully qualify.

tref · #8 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 11:43am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey

Right, but he's talking double personal fouls here. If a goal is involved, the double personal foul typically happened during the shot -- no team control.

True, but if the try was successful then the POI is endline running for the non-scoring team. No arrow necessary on successful trys when a DF occurs.

bainsey · #9 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 11:57am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tref

True, but if the try was successful then the POI is endline running for the non-scoring team. No arrow necessary on successful trys when a DF occurs.

Yup, I'm awake now. Thanks.

Scrapper1 · #10 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 12:40pm

Also, if there's a double personal during a throw-in. No team control, but you don't go to the arrow.

Scrapper1 · #11 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 12:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh Refner

NF rules. Double personal foul called on A1 and B1 at the same time. Do you go to POI or AP? Thanks.

As may be clear by now, Hugh, you go to the POI. However, you haven't given us enough information to determine what the POI is in this case. It may be an AP throw-in, or it could be simply a throw-in to the team that had control.

Multiple Sports · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 12:43pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey

Yup, I'm awake now. Thanks.

Took you til 1 o'clock on this one to wake up ???????

APG · #13 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 12:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Also, if there's a double personal during a throw-in. No team control, but you don't go to the arrow.

Actually there is team control.

But your point still remains.

Adam · #14 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 12:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey

Right, but he's talking double personal fouls here. If a goal is involved, the double personal foul typically happened during the shot -- no team control. Your point on end of period is well taken: tweet, double foul, horn. I'm struggling to think of a scenario where a double foul would precede a violation.

FT, DF on the jockeying, followed by the FT missing the iron.

billyu2 · #15 (**permalink**) Tue Jul 31, 2012, 12:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey

Right, but he's talking double personal fouls here. If a goal is involved, the double personal foul typically happened during the shot -- no team control. Your point on end of period is well taken: tweet, double foul, horn. I'm struggling to think of a scenario where a double foul would precede a violation.

Ball in flight, double foul, offensive basket interference?