National C'Ship

[tref]

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

I thought that the crew did a poor job in two areas:

1) dribble hand-off screens....WAY too much illegal contract by screener that impacted RSBQ of defenders. This was an emphasis during the year that was ignored last night. (this occurred primarliy when Kentucky was on offense))

The pick n roll with the UK guards & AD did catch my eye, but I thought they were marginal at best.
Doesnt RSBQ pertain to the ball handler?

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

2) post defenders (on BOTH ends) were allowed to significantly chest/body bump offensive players in the post after they received a pass....on several occassions, the offensive player was almost knocked over (let alone knocked off balance).

I liked that they allowed the bigs to bang in a National C'Ship game.
Aggresive, physical play is always ok. Rough play is never ok.

[twocentsworth]

Originally Posted by tref

The pick n roll with the UK guards & AD did catch my eye, but I thought they were marginal at best.
Doesnt RSBQ pertain to the ball handler?

No...RSBQ applies to ALL players on the court (defenders as well as offensive players).

Originally Posted by tref

I liked that they allowed the bigs to bang in a National C'Ship game. Aggresive, physical play is always ok. Rough play is never ok.

The same argument that says: "a foul at the end of the game should be called the same as a foul at the beginning of the game"...is in essence saying: "a foul in the national championship game should be called the same as a foul in the regular season".

imho, the ball screen and post defense plays were called differently than earlier in the year.

Let's see how John Adams "grades out" the crew.

From what I've been told, these were the percentage of correct calls (as determined by John Adams) in previous NCAA Championship games:

2010 Duke v Butler: 78%
2009 North Carolina v Mich. St.: 70%

btw, the best officials in the NBA (who advance to the playoffs) are in the 94% or better range.

[tomegun]

I thought there were several plays that were fouls and were not called. One play that comes to mind was when a Kansas defender just ran into Teague on the perimeter. Teague did a good job of not traveling as a result of the contact.

I'm not sure which of the officials was where on the calls I thought were fouls and it doesn't really matter to me.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I thought there were several plays that were fouls and were not called. One play that comes to mind was when a Kansas defender just ran into Teague on the perimeter. Teague did a good job of not traveling as a result of the contact.

I'm not sure which of the officials was where on the calls I thought were fouls and it doesn't really matter to me.

I agree.

I also did not like the fact that quite often both the T and the C were on the ball handler and his defender as the ball was being brought up court and the offense initiated. No pressure - just the two players, and the C is slowly walking up the court with the dribbler and the T.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

I agree.

I also did not like the fact that quite often both the T and the C were on the ball handler and his defender as the ball was being brought up court and the offense initiated. No pressure - just the two players, and the C is slowly walking up the court with the dribbler and the T.

That is something I have complained about a few times here in the forum. I hate it.

[tref]

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

No...RSBQ applies to ALL players on the court (defenders as well as offensive players).

If you say so... I honestly think you're mistaking FOM for RSBQ.
I guess it all boils down to who's teaching it & how long one has been applying this concept. The people who have been practicing this for more than 5 seasons always seem to have a better understanding than those who have been introduced to this in the last few months.

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

The same argument that says: "a foul at the end of the game should be called the same as a foul at the beginning of the game"...is in essence saying: "a foul in the national championship game should be called the same as a foul in the regular season".

imho, the ball screen and post defense plays were called differently than earlier in the year.

Did those three work together earlier in the year?
Have you watched every game that those three worked this year?
Perhaps the contact by two great defensive teams that have bigs across the board was considered marginal/incidental since nobody was put at a disadvantage?
Afterall, the same contact on a 5'9" player that results in a foul may not be a foul for a 6'9" player.

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

Let's see how John Adams "grades out" the crew.

From what I've been told, these were the percentage of correct calls (as determined by John Adams) in previous NCAA Championship games:

2010 Duke v Butler: 78%
2009 North Carolina v Mich. St.: 70%

btw, the best officials in the NBA (who advance to the playoffs) are in the 94% or better range.

The numbers you listed are Mr. Adams grading out the entire game. Perhaps two officials were in the mid 90s & one officials was considerably lower which in turn drops the crews overall call accuracy ratings.

I respect your opinion though.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by tref

If you say so... I honestly think you're mistaking FOM for RSBQ.
I guess it all boils down to who's teaching it & how long one has been applying this concept. The people who have been practicing this for more than 5 seasons always seem to have a better understanding than those who have been introduced to this in the last few months.

I have to ask, what's the substantive difference between FOM and RSBQ? They're both just different ways to say "prevented from participating in normal defensive or offensive movements." Don't get me wrong , I think they're great thought processes; but I find the insistence on a distinction on when to use which term to be silly. It's sort of like all the responses that come when someone says a coach "called" a timeout, or worrying about "baseline" vs "endline."

[tref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I have to ask, what's the substantive difference between FOM and RSBQ? They're both just different ways to say "prevented from participating in normal defensive or offensive movements." Don't get me wrong , I think they're great thought processes; but I find the insistence on a distinction on when to use which term to be silly. It's sort of like all the responses that come when someone says a coach "called" a timeout, or worrying about "baseline" vs "endline."

I respect that Snaqs.

But the substantive difference is:

RSBQ pertains to the ball handler & FOM applies to all players (offense & defense).

We did watch the captains meetings videos I shared with you guys last week, didnt we? I swear they said FOM applies to everybody. Chucks, holds, wraps, re-routes generally apply to FOM.

If the rhythm, speed, balance & quickness of a defender or offensive player without the ball is affected, it may or may not be a foul. They might recover quickly & be able to participate in normal defensive or offensive movements.
Or, it might not even have a bearing on the play ie; marginal screening infraction on the weakside that stumbles the defender, but the ball is already strongside in the post & a poster shot is imminent.
I'd like to see somebody call that foul & take away the dunk based on the RSBQ philosophy!! As a matter of fact, I'd LOVE to see that & hear the conversation with the coach as well

If the rhythm, speed, balance & quickness of the ball handler is affected, this is an absolute, an immediate whistle is required.

And that folks, is the substantive difference

[Multiple Sports]

ie; marginal screening infraction on the weakside that stumbles the defender, but the ball is already strongside in the post & a poster shot is imminent.
I'd like to see somebody call that foul & take away the dunk based on the RSBQ philosophy!! As a matter of fact, I'd LOVE to see that & hear the conversation with the coach as well


I see this play (mentioned above ), where there is a weakside screen maginally illegal and the ball is strongside being shop by a guy who is 40% behind the 3pt arc. We get into the lockeroom and two guys are rubbing each others stones saying they are working hard off the ball and what a great call that was, when (IMO) we stopped play for nothing....


Thoughts ????????

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by Multiple Sports

We get into the lockeroom and two guys are rubbing each others stones.....Thoughts ????????

Yeah. They should get a room. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[onetime1]

I love the Fray and have seen them perform at summerfest in Milwaukee twice. They are very unique. I loved their version of the Anthem. Caught myself singing along for once. Great job.