Senior Moment?

[ddn]

Last night, as L I had a foul on 42 white, 12 blue shooting two (it was a bit of a scrum under the basket on the shoot - boy's jv game. I go to the table to report and had no recollection at all on who the foul was on - they only thing that came to mind was "12". Went over to my partner, and he had no idea (this was a boy's jv game, 2 officials). The kids were lined up for the throw so I asked them "who'd I call that foul on". White 42 fessed up and the light went off and I remembered it was 42.

If 42 would not have fessed up, what could I have done? Just picked a white player? I've mixed numbers up when reporting, but this is the first that I've completely forgot - well, that I can remember

[Bad Zebra]

Not much you can do other than give it your best shot as to who the offender was. Been there, done that numerous times. Now, as part of my pre-game, I encourage partners to be active during dead balls by noting which player fouled, which are shooting, what time is on the clock, ball location, etc. in other words, don't go to sleep just because a partner is making the call.

[Loudwhistle2]

Originally Posted by ddn

Last night, as L I had a foul on 42 white, 12 blue shooting two (it was a bit of a scrum under the basket on the shoot - boy's jv game. I go to the table to report and had no recollection at all on who the foul was on - they only thing that came to mind was "12". Went over to my partner, and he had no idea (this was a boy's jv game, 2 officials). The kids were lined up for the throw so I asked them "who'd I call that foul on". White 42 fessed up and the light went off and I remembered it was 42.

If 42 would not have fessed up, what could I have done? Just picked a white player? I've mixed numbers up when reporting, but this is the first that I've completely forgot - well, that I can remember

Don't forget to ask the table as well (quietly) most of the time they are pretty sure who the foul is on and they can be helpful in this situation. As a matter of a fact when we are about to start the game, all the refs shake hands and then shake hands with the table personel. I always tell the table folks, "watch who we call the fouls on, I may lose the number!" About once every two years or so they will save my arse!

[ref3808]

I had a habit of making a call, but not really being diligent about stating it at the spot and then going to the reporting area. I've worked on that and it has really helped me be more accurate and organized when I get to the area. Also, my partner has typically heard the call and if I do have a memory lapse he/she is more able to help.

Also, when working with a good table crew, they've often times noted the number of the player who fouled and if you call a number they don't expect they'll initiate a short conversation to make sure it's correct. I don't want to have this happen often but I'd rather get it correctly booked.

Sometimes if there's a physical characteristic you can note as well as the number it will help. eg: tallest player on the court. etc.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ddn

What could I have done?

If there was absolutely no way of determining who the foul should be charged to (see excellent suggestions from esteemed members in previous posts), then don't guess. Just have the scorekeeper mark the foul as a team foul. I hope that you remembered the correct team color.

[billyu2]

Originally Posted by ddn

Last night, as L I had a foul on 42 white, 12 blue shooting two (it was a bit of a scrum under the basket on the shoot - boy's jv game. I go to the table to report and had no recollection at all on who the foul was on - they only thing that came to mind was "12". Went over to my partner, and he had no idea (this was a boy's jv game, 2 officials). The kids were lined up for the throw so I asked them "who'd I call that foul on". White 42 fessed up and the light went off and I remembered it was 42.

If 42 would not have fessed up, what could I have done? Just picked a white player? I've mixed numbers up when reporting, but this is the first that I've completely forgot - well, that I can remember

Do you say (out loud) the player's # when making your call? That's one of the things I have gotten in the habit of doing especially now that I'm getting older and it really helps. Also if there's a lot of players in the area (scrum) that's one of the few times I will come in with a bird-dog to indicate exactly who I have the foul on and again, I say the player's number before leaving to report. (also indicating throw-in spot or # of FT's)

[SCalScoreKeeper]

I had this happen in a game over break except instead of forgetting a number he reported it on the wrong kid.At the quarter break he came over and asked us to correct the previous foul.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by ddn

If 42 had not fessed up, what could I have done? Just picked a white player? I've mixed numbers up when reporting, but this is the first that I've completely forgot - well, that I can remember

Remember that the table crew are also officials and may assist with officiating the game. Check with them, as they often know who committed the foul before you report it. As you say, sometimes a person simply saying "42" will jog your memory, at which point you can say, "right! 42 white!"

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Remember that the table crew are also officials and may assist with officiating the game. Check with them, as they often know who committed the foul before you report it. As you say, sometimes a person simply saying "42" will jog your memory, at which point you can say, "right! 42 white!"

Regarding getting assistance from the table crew...
Under Fed rules are we allowed go the table to confirm that a shot went in? I couldn't find that specific situation covered in rule book or case book.

I messed up last week and had no idea if the ball went in when P asked me if the shot was good after he called a foul on a drive to the hoop in a BJV. Bad officiating on my part.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by ddn

Last night, as L I had a foul on 42 white, 12 blue shooting two (it was a bit of a scrum under the basket on the shoot - boy's jv game. I go to the table to report and had no recollection at all on who the foul was on - they only thing that came to mind was "12". Went over to my partner, and he had no idea (this was a boy's jv game, 2 officials). The kids were lined up for the throw so I asked them "who'd I call that foul on". White 42 fessed up and the light went off and I remembered it was 42.

If 42 would not have fessed up, what could I have done? Just picked a white player? I've mixed numbers up when reporting, but this is the first that I've completely forgot - well, that I can remember

Eons ago, I remember telling me how he remembered numbers, he treated the fouler and fouler's numbers as a street number, in your case: 4212 (forty-two, twelve).

And now for a humorus story. A long time friend of mine who has been a multi-conference (including four power conferences) men's D-I official for over 20 years and has made it as least 3 rounds deep into the tournament for at least the last ten years is working a MAC game a few years (my wife and I were in attendence) called a foul, got to the Table and then realized he had forgot who had committed the foul and had to go back to the players and asked who committed the foul. It happens to the best of us and he is one of the best.

MTD, Sr.

[ddn]

Thanks for all the suggestions and advice everyone - I have a few new mental braces to go along w/ the calf, shin, and ankle wraps to add to my gear bag....

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by KJUmp

Regarding getting assistance from the table crew...
Under Fed rules are we allowed go the table to confirm that a shot went in? I couldn't find that specific situation covered in rule book or case book.

I messed up last week and had no idea if the ball went in when P asked me if the shot was good after he called a foul on a drive to the hoop in a BJV. Bad officiating on my part.

Yes. I had to do that a couple weeks ago: called a foul as lead, and neither C nor T could tell me if the shot was good. It was a train wreck under the basket, but one of them should have known.

[billyu2]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Yes. I had to do that a couple weeks ago: called a foul as lead, and neither C nor T could tell me if the shot was good. It was a train wreck under the basket, but one of them should have known.

I agree. There's another situation in the Casebook ( 5.10.1 D) that says the timer and scorer can be used to gain specific information. I think it would be safe to say it could be done in other situations as well.

[Adam]

I did it yesterday, and the table saved me. I started reporting the color and number of the shooter rather than the fouler, then turned around to the players knowing what I had done.

Table: "Blue 33."
Me: "Yes, thank you, Blue 33."

I then sheepishly took my position opposite the table.

[Rob1968]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I did it yesterday, and the table saved me. I started reporting the color and number of the shooter rather than the fouler, then turned around to the players knowing what I had done.

Table: "Blue 33."
Me: "Yes, thank you, Blue 33."

I then sheepishly took my position opposite the table.

I reported a foul on 34, the other night. The scorekeeper is an ex-official, and as I turned away, he said, "We don't have a 34 on the floor." I realized it was on 43, and corrected it, and told him, "It's just my dislexia coming out . . . again!"