Part 2 test questions

[zm1283]

From our state Part 2 test:

It is an alternating-possession throw-in when A1’s throw-in lodges between the backboard and the ring.

I answered True. 6-4-3d says: "An AP throw-in shall result when: d) A live ball lodges between the backboard and ring or comes to rest on the flange, unless a free throw or throw-in follows". A thrown ball on a throw-in is a live ball, so a live thrown ball lodges between the backboard and ring and an AP throw-in results....right?

Then 9-2-8 outlines the penalty: "The thrown ball shall not become lodged between the backboard and ring or come to rest on the flange before it touches or is touched by another player". That would mean it is a violation by the throwing team, right? So which is it? I got it wrong on the test.

The other one, and I really have a problem with how it is worded....

To correct an error it must be recognized by an official during the first dead ball after the clock has properly started.

This says "...it must be recognized by an official DURING the first dead ball after the clock has properly started". 2-10-2 is worded "In order to correct any of the officials' errors listed in Article 1, such error must be recognized by an official NO LATER THAN DURING the first dead ball after the clock has properly started".

I answered that False, because the rule plainly says that it must be recognized no later than during the first dead ball, not that it has to be recognized DURING that first dead ball. The question is implying that you can't recognized and correct it while the ball is live before the first dead ball.

What am I missing here? These were the only two I got wrong.

[Raymond]

Choose the rule that specifically and directly speaks to the scenario. Which is it? Well, doesn't the fact that you got the question wrong tell you which it is?

On the correctable error, we do not know until the ball is dead whether or not an official recognized an error. He's not going to talk about it during a live ball.

[ga314ref]

...drive me crazy, but I guess they're designed to get your full focus and attention.

"It is an alternating-possession throw-in when A1’s throw-in lodges between the backboard and the ring. 9-2-8 says "no".

The second question, in my opinion, is just plain unclear. Maybe if enough people appeal it, your governing body will act on it. Good luck.

[silverpie]

Agreed that the specific overrides the general on the throw-in play, although I'd suggest a parenthetical be added to 6-4-3d along the lines of (except a throw-in; see 9-2-8) after the words "live ball." (This also makes me wish the books were large enough to make a note in the margin, or else available in an e-book format that allowed it.)

On the correctable-error question, I never had a professor who would score that type as anything but False...

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by silverpie

Agreed that the specific overrides the general on the throw-in play, although I'd suggest a parenthetical be added to 6-4-3d along the lines of (except a throw-in; see 9-2-8) after the words "live ball." (This also makes me wish the books were large enough to make a note in the margin, or else available in an e-book format that allowed it.)

On the correctable-error question, I never had a professor who would score that type as anything but False...

With the correctable error, until the ball is dead there is no way for the official to formally recognize the error. Don't think of "recognize" in terms of an internal thought by an official, think of it as an action taken by an official.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by silverpie

Agreed that the specific overrides the general on the throw-in play, although I'd suggest a parenthetical be added to 6-4-3d along the lines of (except a throw-in; see 9-2-8) after the words "live ball." (This also makes me wish the books were large enough to make a note in the margin, or else available in an e-book format that allowed it.)

On the correctable-error question, I never had a professor who would score that type as anything but False...

It already says "unless a FT or TI follows". IT's similar to POI -- if you know what would have happened, do that. Only if you don't know what would have happened do you go to the arrow.

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

It already says "unless a FT or TI follows". IT's similar to POI -- if you know what would have happened, do that. Only if you don't know what would have happened do you go to the arrow.

Not trying to just argue, but how do we know what would happen if the ball had not lodged between the backboard and ring?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by zm1283

Not trying to just argue, but how do we know what would happen if the ball had not lodged between the backboard and ring?

Another FT. A throwin. Or, a violation causes a throwin.

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Another FT. A throwin. Or, a violation causes a throwin.

Yeah, I see what you mean. I guess that is assuming that the ball getting lodged is a violation in the first place. I do wish it said something in 6-4-3 about the throw-in since it is a live ball and all.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by zm1283

Not trying to just argue, but how do we know what would happen if the ball had not lodged between the backboard and ring?

You don't, that's why you go to the AP arrow except if occurs during a throw-in (violation) or if we subsquently will be shooting free throws and having a throw-in.

A1 gets fouled while shooting and balls lodges between the rim and the backboard. No AP arrow because A1 still has to shoot free throws.

While A1's shot is in flight A2 fouls B2 and the balls then becomes lodged. No AP arrow because Team B is entitled to either free throws or a throw-in.

Following an intentional or technical foul, the last of A1's free throws gets lodged. No AP arrow b/c Team A is entitled to a throw-in.

And remember, if the throw-in gets tipped by either team and the ball lodges then we go to the AP arrow b/c the throw-in had ended prior to the ball getting lodged.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

You don't, that's why you go to the AP arrow except if occurs during a throw-in (violation) or if we subsquently will be shooting free throws and having a throw-in.

A1 gets fouled while shooting and balls lodges between the rim and the backboard. No AP arrow because A1 still has to shoot free throws.

While A1's shot is in flight A2 fouls B2 and the balls then becomes lodged. No AP arrow because Team B is entitled to either free throws or a throw-in.

Following an intentional or technical foul, the last of A1's free throws gets lodged. No AP arrow b/c Team A is entitled to a throw-in.

And remember, if the throw-in gets tipped by either team and the ball lodges then we go to the AP arrow b/c the throw-in had ended prior to the ball getting lodged.

Right. And all that is too much to put into the exception (and even if they had all that, someone would ask, "but what about ....?"), so they worded it the way they did.

[ref2coach]

Just got the following email from the State Admin. Assistant.
IMPORTANT INFORMATION!!!!
1. For various reasons, the Part II Basketball Exam has been extended until Midnight on Friday, December 16th.

2. We have discovered three questions on the exam that have some type of error. Therefore, any score of 74, 76, or 78 will automatically be changed to a passing score of 80 after we download the scores.

3. Please read the exam instructions before you start!!! I receive so many emails with questions regarding user name and passwords. It is right there on the exam instructions – which were in your packet and are also on the website.

Good luck, Merry Christmas and Have A Very Happy and Blessed New Year!!!

I tried to get my 94 changed to a 100 because I had sent in the rule references to 3 of the "error" questions. I was not successful.