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stiffler3492 Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:57pm

APG Video Request
 
Duke-Ohio State tonight on ESPN.

Around the 12:50 mark of the 2nd half, B1 tips the ball away from A1. A2 goes to grab it, and starts dribbling. The ball bounces in the frontcourt, but his feet are in the backcourt.

From the TV view, it didn't seem like the ball ever got to the backcourt, nor did B1 gain player control.

Adam Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:28am

Mary Struckoff would tell you this is a violation. B1 is the last to touch the ball "before" it goes into the BC, however, so I wouldn't call it.

Camron Rust Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:39am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 800672)
Mary Struckoff would tell you this is a violation. B1 is the last to touch the ball "before" it goes into the BC, however, so I wouldn't call it.

Agree....no violation.

stiffler3492 Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:44am

What about the ball not even getting to the backcourt? Would the first to touch/last to touch requirement not apply then? If A1 recovers before the ball gets to the backcourt, but his feet are in the backcourt while he is in PC, how can that not be a violation?

just another ref Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:48am

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiffler3492 (Post 800677)
What about the ball not even getting to the backcourt? Would the first to touch/last to touch requirement not apply then? If A1 recovers before the ball gets to the backcourt, but his feet are in the backcourt while he is in PC, how can that not be a violation?

If A1 recovers the ball with his feet in the backcourt, the ball is now in the backcourt.

stiffler3492 Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:59am

I see what you're saying. The play in question is available to see now on espn3.com. Again, it's around the 12:50 mark, 2nd half.

Welpe Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:07am

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiffler3492 (Post 800680)
I see what you're saying. The play in question is available to see now on espn3.com. Again, it's around the 12:50 mark, 2nd half.

It was a correct no call. Despite the senseless casebook play, I would be hard pressed to call that in an NFHS game.

Welpe Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:10am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 800715)
Not under the new FED wording of the rules ;)

It didn't fit the old wording but that crazy casebook play didn't seem to care.

twocentsworth Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:17am

i thought it was a violation when it happened...look at it again via DVR and still think so (although it would be hard to explain to everybody).

Aaron Craft (OSU PG) touched/started dribbling the ball when BOTH of his feet were in the backcourt...violation. This isn't soccer - where a player can be out of bounds touching the ball even if the ball isn't out of bounds. By rule, this should have been a backcourt violation.

Adam Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:25am

Quote:

Originally Posted by twocentsworth (Post 800719)
i thought it was a violation when it happened...look at it again via DVR and still think so (although it would be hard to explain to everybody).

Aaron Craft (OSU PG) touched/started dribbling the ball when BOTH of his feet were in the backcourt...violation. This isn't soccer - where a player can be out of bounds touching the ball even if the ball isn't out of bounds. By rule, this should have been a backcourt violation.

Please read the rule again. BC is not the same as OOB. The rule says the team in control has to be the last to touch the ball before it goes into the bc. In this play, B1 was the last to touch it. If you can't explain it, how can you call it?

Welpe Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:31am

What Snaqs said. The OSU player started dribbling when he was standing in the backcourt but the ball was in the front court. Team B (Duke) was the last to touch in the front court so this is not a backcourt violation.

Since the player is now dribbling, the ball is not in the frontcourt until the ball and both of the dribbler's feet are in the frontcourt.

stiffler3492 Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:39am

The only way this could be a violation, then, is if A1 recovered the ball while he was still in the frontcourt, then stepped into the backcourt.

It's tough to tell from the TV angle if that's what happened.

twocentsworth Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:47am

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiffler3492 (Post 800727)
The only way this could be a violation, then, is if A1 recovered the ball while he was still in the frontcourt, then stepped into the backcourt.

It's tough to tell from the TV angle if that's what happened.

what I saw was an OSU player dribbling the ball, deflected/touched by a Duke player, OSU player touches ball in attempt to recover, ball goes near backcourt line, OSU player (Aaron Craft) regains control by dribbling while his feet were clearly in the backcourt.

that, by rule is a back court violation.

Adam Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:52am

Quote:

Originally Posted by twocentsworth (Post 800730)
what I saw was an OSU player dribbling the ball, deflected/touched by a Duke player, OSU player touches ball in attempt to recover, ball goes near backcourt line, OSU player (Aaron Craft) regains control by dribbling while his feet were clearly in the backcourt.

that, by rule is a back court violation.

Are you saying an OSU player touched it in the FC after Duke tipped it but before the ball was touched by the player standing in the BC?

Welpe Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:54am

Quote:

Originally Posted by twocentsworth (Post 800730)
what I saw was an OSU player dribbling the ball, deflected/touched by a Duke player, OSU player touches ball in attempt to recover, ball goes near backcourt line, OSU player (Aaron Craft) regains control by dribbling while his feet were clearly in the backcourt.

that, by rule is a back court violation.

I did not see that in the ESPN3 feed, I saw a Team B tip and then Team A begin his dribble while standing in the backcourt.


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