Swing'in those Elbows

[The_Rookie]

Have had coaches complain about this...so some guidance on this please:

How do you judge the difference between excessive swinging of the elbows as a violation versus a foul?

Thanks!

[Refsmitty]

I've called the violation twice against boys who look to clear space without making contact but I deemed it excessive - a 90 degree turn.

[Refsmitty]

If no contact no foul - if contact - could be common or flagrant

[JRutledge]

If there is no contact it has to be excessive, not just one swing through to call a violation. If there is contact with the elbow, you have to decide what took place just like any other situation with contact.

Peace

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Refsmitty

I've called the violation twice against boys who look to clear space without making contact but I deemed it excessive - a 90 degree turn.

The "arc" of the turn has nothing to do with it. It's whether the elbow swings by pivoting from the shoulder (excessive) or by pivoting the torso (not excessive)

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by The_Rookie

Have had coaches complain about this...so some guidance on this please:

How do you judge the difference between excessive swinging of the elbows as a violation versus a foul?

C'mon man! Think a little.

Are you going to call a foul if there's no contact?

Are you going to call a violation if he nails him in the head?

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

C'mon man! Think a little.

Somebody got up on the Jurassic side of the bed this morning!

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Somebody got up on the Jurassic side of the bed this morning!

Channeling

[bainsey]

I have this call (the violation) about once or twice per year. It still confuses some.

I had a JV tournament a few years ago of which my kid was shooting video. One player goes up for the rebound, comes down, and swings his elbows to clear people out. Easy call.

Just before I administered the throw in, the horn sounded. The table wanted clarity on who committed the foul. I informed the table is was only a violation, "excessive elbow swinging," and there were several audiable scoffs from the small crowd.

"That's called a FOUL, sir!" one yelled.

"No, it's not!" my kid fired back from behind the camera. "Learn your rules!"

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Somebody got up on the Jurassic side of the bed this morning!

Really just trying to get him to think it through for himslef, rather than asking someone to tell him the answer. It's a better way to learn and own it.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Really just trying to get him to think it through for himslef, rather than asking someone to tell him the answer. It's a better way to learn and own it.

+1. He's not going to be able to have Q&A on the court during a game.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Really just trying to get him to think it through for himslef, rather than asking someone to tell him the answer. It's a better way to learn and own it.

I know, and I agree with that. We just hadn't had a Jurassic sighting in a while, and that was the closest I've seen.