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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 02:52pm
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Last night had 3 JV's games. Boys. Same coach all night on one schools side. Plenty of time to "get to know him".

The coach was active verbally. When he yelled instructions to his players - he always mentioned "....and the ref won't see it". "Do this, that and you won't be seen". "Bump him underneith and the ref will miss it". etc. etc. etc.

It was HARD not getting distracted and over-watching for this crap (his instructions) being done on the floor. Became more an issue with my partner.

Before game 3 we spoke to him pregame about feeling discreditied. Please stand down on that stuff. He was cool.

Game 3 was tight, I'm trailing. An opponent's three point shooter right in front of me gets knocked back three steps by a guy "blocking out". I protect shooter. Whistle.

Coach starts praising the kid "You did right thats exactly what I teach you (defender). Bad call. Hey ref I teach that. That was text book."

My Partner throws the Tech. Discreditied.

Would You ?



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Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 03:05pm
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Absolutely.

In fact, had I heard his comments in the first game, and once I knew that he was coaching the 2nd game, I would have made sure that I didn't "miss" any of the calls that he thoughts I might. If there was one that was 50-50, I'd call it (and make sure I call it at the other end if it was there). If you can call two of these, he should have received the message that his comments are not welcome. I'd also talk to him at the 2nd game halftime.

Mike
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 03:17pm
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Wink Try to warn.

Just warn him. When you get a chance say to him, "coach you are coming close to a line here." He probably will tell you, "I was talking to my players." Ignore that and if he keeps being sarcastic or disrespectful with backhanded comments, nail him. He will figure it out and change is behavior if he wanted to stay. But if you can stop the behavior without giving a T do it. But a much better official than me always told me, "when the roll the dice, they just might crap out." Just because other officials took his crap, does not give him the license or the right to disrespect you.

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  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 03:24pm
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Originally posted by Ref Daddy
Coach starts praising the kid "You did right thats exactly what I teach you (defender). Bad call. Hey ref I teach that. That was text book."

...Hey Coach, this is "text book" also...whack "T"!

Dude
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 03:29pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ref Daddy

Last night had 3 JV's games. Boys. Same coach all night on one schools side. Plenty of time to "get to know him".

The coach was active verbally. When he yelled instructions to his players - he always mentioned "....and the ref won't see it". "Do this, that and you won't be seen". "Bump him underneith and the ref will miss it". etc. etc. etc.

It was HARD not getting distracted and over-watching for this crap (his instructions) being done on the floor. Became more an issue with my partner.

Before game 3 we spoke to him pregame about feeling discreditied. Please stand down on that stuff. He was cool.

Game 3 was tight, I'm trailing. An opponent's three point shooter right in front of me gets knocked back three steps by a guy "blocking out". I protect shooter. Whistle.

Coach starts praising the kid "You did right thats exactly what I teach you (defender). Bad call. Hey ref I teach that. That was text book."

My Partner throws the Tech. Discreditied.

Would You ?



1)I'd inform the coach the first time that I heard his crap that if he's telling his players to foul,he's leaving me no choice but to call a deliberate foul if they do so. Let him chew on that and see if he wants to keep playing that game.The clown is just working you,and he's over the line trying to do that.
2)I'd "T" his a$$ in a heartbeat for that comment-especially after he's been already talked to about making comments like that.How many warnings do you give somebody? My limit is one per type of incident.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 04:04pm
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ref Daddy

The coach was active verbally. When he yelled instructions to his players - he always mentioned "....and the ref won't see it". "Do this, that and you won't be seen". "Bump him underneith and the ref will miss it". etc. etc. etc.
__________________________________________________ _________


After I heard this about once or twice I would have quietly told him: "Coach, if you are going to be telling your team to do things so I won't see them, you need to do it quietly in the huddle. Understand? Thank you."

__________________________________________________ __________

Coach starts praising the kid "You did right thats exactly what I teach you (defender). Bad call. Hey ref I teach that. That was text book."

__________________________________________________ __________


Sounds like he wanted one to me. Anybody with air to put in the whistle would have given him one.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 06:13pm
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Re: Try to warn.

Quote:
Originally posted by JRutledge
Just warn him.
He was warned.

Quote:
Originally posted by Ref Daddy
Before game 3 we spoke to him pregame about feeling discreditied. Please stand down on that stuff. He was cool.
Are you gonna warn him all [email protected] night?
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 06:52pm
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good T, if a little late coming, nuff said.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 06:55pm
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I've got the same question as Ref Daddy except for a different situation.

Had a kid today who slammed the ball after the other team scored a basket and a foul. I don't believe he was upset at the call (it was an obvious one) but rather at his team or himself for the way they were playing. He did slam the ball rather hard.

My question is this. Does this behavior automically deserve a Tech or do you consider if it was a show of displeasure at your call?

BTW, I was going to warn him but my partner T'd him right away.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 07:01pm
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Knew a guy that would tell the player, "if that ball hits the ground, it's a T, and watch the player run foolishly around to catch it . . .

In my mind, it's pretty rare that a ball slammed and bouncing over the player's head is not a T
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 10:09pm
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My philosophy is this. If a coach wants to be verbal, that's fine. But the moment he brings the official's credibility or judgment into the conversation, he gets penalized. A well-deserved T and a seatbelt should teach him a lesson.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old Sat Dec 14, 2002, 11:07pm
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Ref Daddy, what does this mean?

It was HARD not getting distracted and over-watching for this crap (his instructions) being done on the floor.

I am considered one of the more "thick-skinned" officials in our area. He would not have made it too far into the 2nd game without earning a "T". It was obvious he was pushing much more than would be tolerable for me.

I agree with Hawkk that at slammed ball almost always earns a "T".
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 15, 2002, 12:18am
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As requested:

All the Coach's chirping - all instructing players to try and beat us (not the other team mind you) got distracting.

Partner and I discussed staying focused on our zones and the plays in front of us. But, him instructing the kids constantly with the "they won't see it" "they won't call it" forced us to follow his verbals to the player almost accepting his challenge.

One exact exchage: "John, get down there - stay there down low. They're not calling three seconds on either team". I started counting right then and I was trailing with heavy guard action.

Summary: Is teaching/coaching the kids to skirt rules demeaning to the referee's; and in and of itself warranting of a T?

We did after warning.
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Old Sun Dec 15, 2002, 12:50am
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I agree with Mike. I would have every foul that I couldn't see and in this case ANY contact is a foul.

T on a slammed ball. The only time I don't T on a slammed ball when it isn't because of us, is if he catches it before right after it comes off the ground. Above his or her head...whack!
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 15, 2002, 12:51am
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That coach would have been T'd by me in the first game. If he did it again, he'd find himself quickly tossed.

A similar thing happened to me in a football game this year. I was the line judge (on the sideline) and the referee threw a flag for a rather obvious foul. The fouled player, however, felt the need to shout about the fact that a foul was committed (even though we all saw it), and the bozos on the sideline stated: "he wouldn't have called it if you didn't say it." Instant UC - I don't see this as any different.
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