One player left

[Jurassic Referee]

Dude,remember back to when you were a coach?You're playing for a championship and this situation comes up,with your team shooting the FT's.The officials don't call a violation on the other team,your FT shooter misses,the remaining player on the other team gets the rebound,throws the ball to the other end of the court,and you LOSE.Now,if you(the coach)happen to know what the specific rule is,are you gonna put in some kind of protest,or are you gonna let it slide?

Not many coaches will let it slide.I also can't blame a coach in this situation for not letting it slide.That's because he just got screwed by the officials.

Now,from the other perspective,if there is a protest,exactly how are you gonna answer it if you were one of the officials? There is no rules basis to justify what you did.

You always have to be fair to both teams when you officiate!

[RookieDude]

...Fair enough...

Dude

[just another ref]

Originally posted by Dan_ref

There is a 100% chance that you, being a good ref, will
tell the team B player to vacate that space before bouncing
the ball to his teammate. [/B]

We had this debate before, somewhere. The B player taking the first position is a violation, but is there something special about this violation? Why tell them about it? If
a player is standing on the line do you warn them to get off the line before you give the shooter the ball? When a player dribbles the ball off his foot and runs and picks it up, do you warn him not to dribble again? What's the difference?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by just another ref
[/B]

We had this debate before, somewhere. The B player taking the first position is a violation, but is there something special about this violation? Why tell them about it? If
a player is standing on the line do you warn them to get off the line before you give the shooter the ball? When a player dribbles the ball off his foot and runs and picks it up, do you warn him not to dribble again? What's the difference? [/B][/QUOTE]In case Dan is busy off chopping the nuts off another poor,defenseless dog,I'll try to answer the question for him.
The difference is that in the first few cases,time is out and you can forestall some minor,technical violations-but,in the last case,play is going on and you don't really know that there is a violation pending until it's actually committed.
What Dan advises on this play is pretty well standard procedure followed by good,experienced officials.

[rainmaker]

Before this discussion goes any further, let's ask this:

What difference does the discussion make? Has anyone EVER had to deal with this? Has anything anywhere near this situation happened? What are the odds of my ever having to understand this aberration?

[theboys]

Y'know, I wasn't going to reply to this, but, since Rainmaker asked, I actually have heard of this happening. Years ago, I read a newspaper article about a corporate league game in which all but one of the players from one team fouled out, with a couple of minutes to go in the game, and the lead. The article detailed how the lone player was able to hold off the other team, and lead...himself...to victory.

No lie.

Unfortunately, I didn't keep the article. I could kick myself for not cutting it out.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

We had this debate before, somewhere. The B player taking the first position is a violation, but is there something special about this violation? Why tell them about it? If
a player is standing on the line do you warn them to get off the line before you give the shooter the ball? When a player dribbles the ball off his foot and runs and picks it up, do you warn him not to dribble again? What's the difference? [/B]

In case Dan is busy off chopping the nuts off another poor,defenseless dog,I'll try to answer the question for him.

[/B][/QUOTE]

Nah. I was in my room, pouting.

The difference is that in the first few cases,time is out and you can forestall some minor,technical violations-but,in the last case,play is going on and you don't really know that there is a violation pending until it's actually committed.
What Dan advises on this play is pretty well standard procedure followed by good,experienced officials.

And even by we lousy inexperienced ones.

BTW, anybody seen my Druid winter solstice ceremony hat?
I'm gonna need it in a couple of weeks...geeze, I hope I
didn't leave it down at the basketball courts...I sure hope
I can order a new one from http://www.purchase_druid_supplies.com in time.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by Dan_ref
.

[/B]

Nah. I was in my room, pouting.


And even by we lousy inexperienced ones.

BTW, anybody seen my Druid winter solstice ceremony hat?
I'm gonna need it in a couple of weeks...geeze, I hope I
didn't leave it down at the basketball courts...I sure hope
I can order a new one from http://www.purchase_druid_supplies.com in time. [/B][/QUOTE]Does someone need a hug to-day?

Got a letter from the state association to wear that hat?

LOL!!

[just another ref]

Originally posted by rainmaker
Before this discussion goes any further, let's ask this:

What difference does the discussion make? Has anyone EVER had to deal with this? Has anything anywhere near this situation happened? What are the odds of my ever having to understand this aberration?

I've had a team get down to one player several times at the elementary level, but always called the game at that point because that team was behind and had no chance to win.
A local jr. high girls team a couple of years ago in a consolation game of a tournament got down to their last player and had a 6 or 8 point lead. They continued to play.
Coach called time out and told his remaining player to try to get in their way as much as possible, then when they scored grab the ball, step slowly out of bounds, hold it for a 4 count, and then heave it toward the other end of the court. Unfortunately the other team tied it up just before the buzzer and the game was called. In a good display of sportsmanship the winning team gave its consolation trophy to the one girl who was left from the losing team.

One other thing: If it did come down to a team with only one player left, and still with a chance to win, good chance there wouldn't be any free throws to worry about, because the last thing that team would need is for that one player to foul out.

[Lotto]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Now,if you(the coach)happen to know what the specific rule is,are you gonna put in some kind of protest,or are you gonna let it slide?

[snip]

Now,from the other perspective,if there is a protest,exactly how are you gonna answer it if you were one of the officials? There is no rules basis to justify what you did.

Of course, there are no "protests" in basketball. Once the game is over and the final score is approved, that's it. The game stands.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by Lotto

Of course, there are no "protests" in basketball. Once the game is over and the final score is approved, that's it. The game stands.

I am well aware that the FED rulebook has language concerning protests.Individual leagues,States,etc. may have their own language,too,and will hear protests.If an official screws up a game badly,the game result may end up standing,but there's also a good chance that the official that screwed up won't be standing for a while,especially in that particular league.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by Dan_ref
[/B]

BTW, anybody seen my Druid winter solstice ceremony hat?
I'm gonna need it in a couple of weeks...geeze, I hope I
didn't leave it down at the basketball courts.[/B][/QUOTE]Hmmmmmm!Looks illegal to me!

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

BTW, anybody seen my Druid winter solstice ceremony hat?
I'm gonna need it in a couple of weeks...geeze, I hope I
didn't leave it down at the basketball courts.[/B]

Hmmmmmm!Looks illegal to me!
[/B][/QUOTE]

Look coach, as far as I'm concerned the robe & the hat are fine. The stick I can live with too, if he promises to keep it out of sight under the robe. But the bird has got to go! I aint gettin' any damn owl droppings all over my freshly shined shoes.

[A Pennsylvania Coach]

Here are my questions from a coach's perspective:

1. What the heck was the trailing team doing shooting a two-pointer (that could result in a two-shot foul) with three seconds left down by three points?

2. If I'm the trailing team's coach, this idea of a continuing FT violation until we make both sounds crazy. We'd be missing the second FT on purpose to get the rebound and put it in. Hmmm. Well, maybe we'd make both, and get the heck out of the way when the one player attempted to inbound. Let his inbound attempt go out of bounds untouched, and get the ball back under our own basket down by one point with :03 left and only one defender. As the lone player having to make that inbound pass, I know if he could he'd try to throw it off one of the opponents and come inbounds and control the deflection. But if all the opponents moved away from the ball...well, where would the throw-in spot be if the lone player rolled the ball in, the opponents stayed away from it, and the lone player ran down the court beside it and picked it up at the opposite foul line?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by Dan_ref
[/B]

But the bird has got to go! I aint gettin' any damn owl droppings all over my freshly shined shoes. [/B][/QUOTE]Can you quote a rule that will cover your actions,Sir? As far as I am aware of, there is no rule in either the NFHS,NCAA,NBA or FIBA rulesets that specifically bars a player from participating with an owl on his shoulder.They don't even need a letter from the State allowing it.

I challenge you to cite a rule barring owls!!