Intentional Foul???

[M&M Guy]

At first I thought, Naaa, just leave it alone.

But then the coach's comment got me to thinking - can a player make a play on the ball with her foot? Sure she can, but it would be a violation if the foot hit the ball. Well, what about just committing a common foul with a foot? Sure, there could be a trip. So, simply making the statement that it has to be an intentional foul "sole-y" because the player used her foot isn't really true.

Now, of course, if you think the player used excessive force in trying to kick the ball or the player, of course there could be an intentional or flagrant call there. But, just as you described it, it sounded like the defender was simply using her leg as a reaction while flying by. So, in that case, I still think, Naaa, just leave it alone and call the common foul.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

At first I thought, Naaa, just leave it alone.

But then the coach's comment got me to thinking - can a player make a play on the ball with her foot? Sure she can, but it would be a violation if the foot hit the ball. Well, what about just committing a common foul with a foot? Sure, there could be a trip. So, simply making the statement that it has to be an intentional foul "sole-y" because the player used her foot isn't really true.

Now, of course, if you think the player used excessive force in trying to kick the ball or the player, of course there could be an intentional or flagrant call there. But, just as you described it, it sounded like the defender was simply using her leg as a reaction while flying by. So, in that case, I still think, Naaa, just leave it alone and call the common foul.

Oh great...now I am second-guessing my second-guessing.

Thanks a lot, Jim.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Oh great...now I am second-guessing my second-guessing.

Thanks a lot, Jim.

No problem.

If you need me for anything else, I'll be right here.

[Eastshire]

If I put on my soccer referee hat for a moment, I would tell you having your foot above your waist that close to an opponent is (likely) a violation for dangerous play even without making contact and that in a sport where you're supposed to use your foot.

In basketball, I'd say contacting a standing opponent above the waist with your foot is excessive force. There is significant chance of injury to A1 and no legal purpose to the foot being that high. Give the intentional and remind the player to keep her feet down.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

If I put on my soccer referee hat for a moment, I would tell you having your foot above your waist that close to an opponent is (likely) a violation for dangerous play even without making contact and that in a sport where you're supposed to use your foot.

In basketball, I'd say contacting a standing opponent above the waist with your foot is excessive force. There is significant chance of injury to A1 and no legal purpose to the foot being that high. Give the intentional and remind the player to keep her feet down.

While I don't disagree with your general premise, how do you regulate players who can jump? What if a defender jumps to block a shot, and their foot makes contact with the other player above the waist, you would consider their foot too high and call an intentional?

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

While I don't disagree with your general premise, how do you regulate players who can jump? What if a defender jumps to block a shot, and their foot makes contact with the other player above the waist, you would consider their foot too high and call an intentional?

First, we're talking about an outstanding vertical leap if he's getting his feet above his opponent's waist by simply jumping. If we assume a player's waist approximately half his height and the shortest basketball player found with any regularity at all is 5' 8" (or 68"), your talking about a 34" vertical leap minimum and that's elite of the elite NBA numbers according to the quick Google search result I just did. It's not likely to happen very often.

I think if a jumper makes contact with his foot while in a near vertical position (as opposed to reaching out/up with the foot) you have a common foul. It's the attempt to play the ball/player with the foot that's dangerous.

[refnrev]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

If I put on my soccer referee hat for a moment, I would tell you having your foot above your waist that close to an opponent is (likely) a violation for dangerous play even without making contact and that in a sport where you're supposed to use your foot.

In basketball, I'd say contacting a standing opponent above the waist with your foot is excessive force. There is significant chance of injury to A1 and no legal purpose to the foot being that high. Give the intentional and remind the player to keep her feet down.

Eastersire,
Your argument here just won't hold water. Your mixing apples and oranges. If she's a leaper than you've penalized her for being athletic. And, as you know, in soccer, just because the foot is above the waist, it isn't necesasarily dangerous play. What if her foot is is facing away from the opponent rather than towards it? Where's the danger?