Pants: Sansabelt vs. Smitty

[tjones1]

Are there still officials who use a pea whistle?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by tjones1

Are there still officials who use a pea whistle?

There's one guy I've worked with in the past who (I think) uses a pea whistle and wears a belt mainly to annoy other officials.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

There's one guy I've worked with in the past who (I think) uses a pea whistle and wears a belt mainly to annoy other officials.

Okay, this makes me laugh.

[ref2coach]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

There's one guy I've worked with in the past who (I think) uses a pea whistle and wears a belt mainly to annoy other officials.

We have one of those in our association. Very good official, funny with a quick dry wit. Loves if someone asks him about the whistle or the belt, they become the butt of his wit the rest of the evening.

[just another ref]

The pealess whistle literally speaks for itself. It's a matter of superior tone and volume. (It's easier to hear) If there is no specific dress code, but we should
"wear beltless pants if we wish to advance," I don't get that.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by just another ref

The pealess whistle literally speaks for itself. It's a matter of superior tone and volume. (It's easier to hear) If there is no specific dress code, but we should
"wear beltless pants if we wish to advance," I don't get that.

Because it looks more professional. You had to go out and buy a pair of pants that fit and you can run in. Wearing a belt suggests you just went around to your local Wal-Mart and picked up a pair of pants. The same as it looks silly as a football and baseball umpire to not buy at hat that fits and use and adjustable hat. It is about perception and when you are the only person doing that, this questions what other things you might have cut corners on. People are looking for "why not" not "why."

Peace

[Cobra]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Because it looks more professional. You had to go out and buy a pair of pants that fit and you can run in. Wearing a belt suggests you just went around to your local Wal-Mart and picked up a pair of pants. The same as it looks silly as a football and baseball umpire to not buy at hat that fits and use and adjustable hat. It is about perception and when you are the only person doing that, this questions what other things you might have cut corners on. People are looking for "why not" not "why."

Peace

That has nothing to do with it. Belted pants are not less professional. Byron collar shirts are not less professional. Shirts with side panels are not less professional. These are just fashion issues, in a few years everything will have changed again.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Cobra

That has nothing to do with it. Belted pants are not less professional. Byron collar shirts are not less professional. Shirts with side panels are not less professional. These are just fashion issues, in a few years everything will have changed again.

He didn't say it was more professional. He said it looks more professional, and he's right. Like it or not, it looks more professional to do as the majority does. That's true for the kind of pants you wear, whether you get patent leather, what kind of lanyard you use, whether you have side panels, which patches you wear, whether you wear glasses on the court, etc.

Jeff's right, perception matters.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Cobra

That has nothing to do with it. Belted pants are not less professional. Byron collar shirts are not less professional. Shirts with side panels are not less professional. These are just fashion issues, in a few years everything will have changed again.

What is, or is not, considered professional is "a fashion issue."

And, the current fashion is that they are more professional.

I agree that in the future this likely will not be so.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Because it looks more professional.

That is an opinion, not a fact, but apparently an opinion that is widely held.
So make it a part of the requirement.
I believe what we have says: Pants shall be black. A belt, if worn shall be black. That's it.
If the scheme of things actually is "Wear a belt if you want, but others will get more/better games," I think that is a bad policy.

Wearing a belt suggests you just went around to your local Wal-Mart and picked up a pair of pants.

I think they have beltless pants at Wal-Mart.

The same as it looks silly as a football and baseball umpire to not buy at hat that fits and use and adjustable hat.

How close does one have to get to even tell whether you have on a fitted cap, let alone notice, let alone care.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by just another ref

How close does one have to get to even tell whether you have on a fitted cap, let alone notice, let alone care.

As someone who works football and baseball, I'll say this: If I see an baseball umpire or a football official with an adjustable hat, it's fairly safe to say I won't be getting a top notch official in that game. There will be exceptions to prove the rule, sure. But for the most part....

And with FlexFit hats quite prevalent these days, it's not that hard to get a hat that *looks* like a fitted hat even if it technically isn't.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by just another ref

That is an opinion, not a fact, but apparently an opinion that is widely held.
So make it a part of the requirement.
I believe what we have says: Pants shall be black. A belt, if worn shall be black. That's it.
If the scheme of things actually is "Wear a belt if you want, but others will get more/better games," I think that is a bad policy.

Well it is a fact that people will make judgments about you and anyone based on their appearance and what you wear. It applies to a guy trying to get a date a woman or a person going to a job interview. I am not going to try to impress a woman by looking like a slop on a date and I am not going to go to a job interview in blue jeans and tennis shoes. And I am certainly not going to work a basketball game with belted pants when everyone else is not wearing them.

Originally Posted by just another ref

I think they have beltless pants at Wal-Mart.

I am sure they do. But I doubt they sell the brand that most officials use or you can buy at Honigs, Gerry Davis Sports or any number of officiating outlets sell. Just like I would not buy a officiating shirt from Wal-Mart, Target or some named sporting good store, I would not buy pants from them either.

Originally Posted by just another ref

How close does one have to get to even tell whether you have on a fitted cap, let alone notice, let alone care.

Actually they do care and they do not have to be close. They can look at your uniform. Just like people can tell someone has sweats on instead of the black pants sold at the places I mentioned for football. Just like I could tell an official was wearing black jeans and not officiating pants years ago. And yes it was reflected in his officiating (surprise!!!!! ).

Peace

[stripes]

Originally Posted by just another ref

The pealess whistle literally speaks for itself. It's a matter of superior tone and volume. (It's easier to hear) If there is no specific dress code, but we should
"wear beltless pants if we wish to advance," I don't get that.

This seems to be the type of opinion that is held by people in my area who never advance. They think that things like this shouldn't matter so they do not need to do what other who are advancing do. It might be an arbitrary standard and you may not agree with it, but if that is what people are doing, play the game. Refusing to play the game because you don't like the game will not help you. I tell officials who are trying to climb the ladder that you want to stand out, but only for your abilities, never for your uniform.

If it is as simple as you will not advance without beltless (or pleated or whatever) pants...GET THE RIGHT PANTS. This is something that is very easy and is in your control. Trying to move up the ladder is so much about things that you cannot control. Control the things you can and help yourself. If you don't want to play the game, don't complain when you lose.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by stripes

If you don't want to play the game, don't complain when you lose.

+1
It applies to the rest of life as well.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by stripes

They think that things like this shouldn't matter so they do not need to do what other who are advancing do.

I'm amused by the guys who think that, because fashion shouldn't matter, they can single-handedly make it not matter by declining to follow it.