Five second responsibility

[River Ref]

In the leads primary is the 5 second count his respondsibility alone? I thought it to be a very good question in my test.
If as center,the play begins in my area and the count, then do not I have the count all the way to the basket?
As the lead,how could I begin a count that would not originate in my primary?
If the closely guarded started in my primary I would be all over it and would expect it to be my count alone.
The exact question was; The lead official is not responsible for 5-second closely guarded counts in his/her primary coverage area?
Can't find it in the book,but believe it would be a shared coverage area. Thanks..........River Ref

[JRutledge]

KISS.

Unless you have a very specific mandate or use a variation of regular mechanics, then the C and T are the only ones that have a closely guarded count. They keep the count until the count stops even if that count goes to someone else's area. That is pretty standard in 3 Person, but that might not apply everywhere. Just telling you what I know and what is normal.

Peace

[Indianaref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

KISS.

Unless you have a very specific mandate or use a variation of regular mechanics, then the C and T are the only ones that have a closely guarded count. They keep the count until the count stops even if that count goes to someone else's area. That is pretty standard in 3 Person, but that might not apply everywhere. Just telling you what I know and what is normal.

Peace

NFHS manual says that the official that has primary coverage is responsible for the five second count. 3.3.2 B.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Indianaref

NFHS manual says that the official that has primary coverage is responsible for the five second count. 3.3.2 B.

Glad we do not use them anymore then. That would be stupid in my opinion to have the Lead calling a closely guarded call that moves away from them.

Peace

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Glad we do not use them anymore then. That would be stupid in my opinion to have the Lead calling a closely guarded call that moves away from them.

Peace

It's no more stupid than having the C or T stay with a count on a play that moves away from them. Though I will say that the situation just doesn't happen very often.

I've had it happen to me as L that I began a 5 second count and the play moved away from me and out of my area. I dropped my count because I'd never seen the L follow a count out of his area. But had I kept my count, it clearly would have been a five second violation.

I talked to several officials I trust in the days following about what I should have done. The majority opinion was that "because nobody does that" is a pretty weak rationale for not making an obvious call. I agree. The next time that happens, I will stay with the play and make the call.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

It's no more stupid than having the C or T stay with a count on a play that moves away from them. Though I will say that the situation just doesn't happen very often.

I disagree. Five seconds is not that long and you have a much better angle. The Lead in 3 Person all of a sudden has to make a call that is likely going away from them and likely straight lined on such a call.

Peace

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

KISS.

Unless you have a very specific mandate or use a variation of regular mechanics, then the C and T are the only ones that have a closely guarded count. They keep the count until the count stops even if that count goes to someone else's area. That is pretty standard in 3 Person, but that might not apply everywhere. Just telling you what I know and what is normal.

Peace

Originally Posted by Indianaref

NFHS manual says that the official that has primary coverage is responsible for the five second count. 3.3.2 B.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Glad we do not use them anymore then. That would be stupid in my opinion to have the Lead calling a closely guarded call that moves away from them.

Peace

Rut, it's clear that your area is the one using a "very specific mandate" that deviates from the norm, and you're aware of it. So, I have to ask why you would answer a test-based question with how you are taught?

Now, if you're referring to the initial count continuing with that official until it terminates, I was under the impression that it's the normal procedure. It's how I was taught in Iowa, and how it's done in Colorado.

But as this discussion continued, it seems you're talking about all 5 second counts that begin in the L's primary.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Rut, it's clear that your area is the one using a "very specific mandate" that deviates from the norm, and you're aware of it. So, I have to ask why you would answer a test-based question with how you are taught?

I am not so sure that what my state does is so different from the "norm." You assume that every state follows the NF to the letter on many things. If I have learned anything from this board I have learned that a lot of areas do things contrary to the NF Mechanics. If that was not the case then we would only see black and white shirts (from NF members) and always see consistent mechanics. At this point we do not see that consistently.

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Now, if you're referring to the initial count continuing with that official until it terminates, I was under the impression that it's the normal procedure. It's how I was taught in Iowa, and how it's done in Colorado.

But as this discussion continued, it seems you're talking about all 5 second counts that begin in the L's primary.

I have said that it looks stupid to have the lead call a closely guarded play in the area. For one the player likely is not going to be in that area very long. Also the player likely did not start in that area either. And I would not like to see a Lead be so focused on the ball when other things are going on there. If you disagree that is OK, but to just blindly say that is the way it should be done is ridiculous. There are a lot of things the NF does that everyone does not agree with. This was not the case until Mary Struckoff tried to implement the NCAA-W philosophy into the high school game. That might work in that game but does not work as well in my opinion at the high school level when the rules are not the same.

Peace