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-   -   Summer Ball - all this fun and I get paid too? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/58520-summer-ball-all-fun-i-get-paid-too.html)

Jurassic Referee Fri Jul 09, 2010 02:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mutantducky (Post 684949)
If another coach did the exact same thing but it is the first time I'm reffing one of his/her games I might pass on a T but not with someone I've had issues with in the past.
And that's exactly why you should be up in the stands yelling at the officials rather than being out on the floor masquerading as one.

You just don't get it.

DLH17 Fri Jul 09, 2010 03:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 684954)
And that's exactly why you should be up in the stands yelling at the officials rather than being out on the floor masquerading as one.

You just don't get it.
mutantducky...If you haven't already blown off this comment, do so, and don't give it another thought.

M&M Guy Fri Jul 09, 2010 03:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 684958)
mutantducky...If you haven't already blown off this comment, do so, and don't give it another thought.
Why? Are you agreeing it's ok for mutantducky to sit in the stands and yell at other officials?

http://forum.officiating.com/basketb...nightmare.html

Jurassic Referee Fri Jul 09, 2010 04:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 684958)
mutantducky...If you haven't already blown off this comment, do so, and don't give it another thought.
And you very obviously don't get it either. Maybe you should be sitting up there with the Mutant yelling at the officials along with him.

Feel free to blow off these comments also without giving them another thought.

just another ref Fri Jul 09, 2010 04:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mutantducky (Post 684949)
I might pass on a T but not with someone I've had issues with in the past.
JR tends to state things strongly:D but it's hard to argue with him here. Why is this any different than calling a personal foul on a player because he always fouled out "in the past."

Personally, if anything, I may be less likely to T a coach who has been a jerk in the past because I make a point of avoiding any interaction.

Nevadaref Sat Jul 10, 2010 12:07am
I happen to agree with JR's sentiments in post #61. For mutantducky to write that he would treat two coaches who did "the exact same thing" differently is as unfair and wrong an action that an official could take in a game.

We constantly talk about treating both teams equally. Mutantducky very clearly wrote that he wouldn't do that. There is no place for that in officiating.

Camron Rust Sat Jul 10, 2010 01:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 684973)
I happen to agree with JR's sentiments in post #61. For mutantducky to write that he would treat two coaches who did "the exact same thing" differently is as unfair and wrong an action that an official could take in a game.

We constantly talk about treating both teams equally. Mutantducky very clearly wrote that he wouldn't do that. There is no place for that in officiating.
Are you talking about in the same game or over time? I know that no two games are exactly the same and the calls needed in one game do not necessarily match those in another game. The same actions might elicit different responses depending on the scenario.

In different games, I very well may treat two coaches who did "the exact same thing" differently. I might even do it in the same game depending on the overall picture of events...not just based on the single action.

Adam Sat Jul 10, 2010 08:20pm
I agree with Camron when it comes to ABS stuff. I also agree somewhat with jar, in that I'm likely to attempt a little more preventative GM with a coach whom I've rung up before. Communicate with him earlier, most likely. It's more of a general growth approach for me, though; taking the Ts as learning experiences.

DLH17 Mon Jul 12, 2010 01:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 684959)
Why? Are you agreeing it's ok for mutantducky to sit in the stands and yell at other officials?
no, i'm only suggesting he blow off a ridiculous (and apparently venomous) directive from a fellow (anonymous) official (jurassic ref) to drop out of the fraternity for posting something relatively benign about his approach to handling coaches with technical fouls.

Jurassic Referee Mon Jul 12, 2010 02:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 685141)
no, i'm only suggesting he blow off a ridiculous (and apparently venomous) directive from a fellow (anonymous) official (jurassic ref) to drop out of the fraternity for posting something relatively benign about his approach to handling coaches with technical fouls.
And you also think that it's "relatively benign" to advocate treating identical acts from different coaches completely differently depending on the past history of the individual coach? One act deserves a "T" because it came from a coach that gave you a hard time in the past.... but an identical act from a different coach is perfectly OK?

Methinks you also should be sitting beside the Mutant up in the stands. You're two of a kind ...and neither one of you gets it. Personally, I wouldn't want to share a court with either of you.

Real officials don't play favorites. And real officials actually do call it both ways.

JMRVO. :)

DLH17 Mon Jul 12, 2010 02:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 685147)
And you also think that it's "relatively benign" to advocate treating identical acts from different coaches completely differently depending on the past history of the individual coach? One act deserves a "T" because it came from a coach that gave you a hard time in the past.... but an identical act from a different coach is perfectly OK?

Methinks you also should be sitting beside the Mutant up in the stands. You're two of a kind ...and neither one of you gets it. Personally, I wouldn't want to share a court with either of you.

Real officials don't play favorites. And real officials actually do call it both ways.

JMRVO. :)
Actually, you don't "get it". Your attempts at being a dictator towards posters you don't even know are laughable. Who really knows, mutantducky might actually be a quack, but if your strong armed, alienating style on this forum is any reflection of your demeanor amongst your peers, then I'm surprised anyone other than the old codgers that have learned to put up with you would ever want to take the court with you.

mbyron Mon Jul 12, 2010 02:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 685152)
Actually, you don't "get it". Your attempts at being a dictator towards posters you don't even know are laughable. Who really knows, mutantducky might actually be a quack, but if your strong armed, alienating style on this forum is any reflection of your demeanor amongst your peers, then I'm surprised anyone other than the old codgers that have learned to put up with you would ever want to take the court with you.
Basketball officiating is not, above a certain level, about hugs and kisses. You run the game with confidence, or you're eaten alive. JR knows how to run a game smoothly. He doesn't need to know you. It's your prerogative not to get along with an alpha dog, but the content of what JR is telling you is, IMO, correct.

You know only the current, more nurturing JR -- you should have seen him back in the day!

DLH17 Mon Jul 12, 2010 02:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 685153)
Basketball officiating is not, above a certain level, about hugs and kisses. You run the game with confidence, or you're eaten alive. JR knows how to run a game smoothly. He doesn't need to know you. It's your prerogative not to get along with an alpha dog, but the content of what JR is telling you is, IMO, correct.

You know only the current, more nurturing JR -- you should have seen him back in the day!
I'm not talking about how he chooses to run a game. I'll take your word for it that he's a stallion. However, what I am talking about his inability to constructively discuss a topic on the internet with a fellow official - even if that fellow official might come off as a bit of a turd like ducky i.e. that link to his discussion about yelling at officials as a fan.

Heck, if JR is going to take the time to respond to mutantducky at all (he must see some value in it or he wouldn't 'waste his time'), then why not post something of value instead of raking the guy? If for no other reason than to help out lurkers (and we know there are plenty of those) that may be reading his posts for the first time and are genuinely interested in the thread up and to that point.

Instead, he shows his a$$.

Just ridiculous.

M&M Guy Mon Jul 12, 2010 02:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 685141)
no, i'm only suggesting he blow off a ridiculous (and apparently venomous) directive from a fellow (anonymous) official (jurassic ref) to drop out of the fraternity for posting something relatively benign about his approach to handling coaches with technical fouls.
I don't think the following is "benign" at all:
Quote:
Originally Posted by mutantducky
...so if he doesn't show the refs respect then yeah I'll T him up. If another coach did the exact same thing but it is the first time I'm reffing one of his/her games I might pass on a T...
The above, as stated, shows an obvious lack of consistency that every good official I know strives to avoid. That, along with the post telling about sitting in the stands and yelling at other officials (did you read that, by the way?), tells a lot of us that mutanyducky is a little lacking in the skills needed to become a good official.

Maybe the mutant mallard one was actually wanting to say what Camron Rust posted, about different situations in different games sometimes warrant different actions. Maybe the post about sitting in the stands was actually about being around a bunch of friends during the neighborhood driveway pickup game, and everyone was yucking it up. But that's not what was communicated, and communication is a big part of being a good official. So, either mutantducky is a poor communicator, or (s)he actually described what they did during actual games, which would also be the sign of an official that needs improvement.

Jurassic's post may have come across as a little blunt, but it usually comes as a result of many, many, many, many (ok, a lot of) years of experience, and he usually knows his stuff. Call it his version of tough love. But if his posts really bother you, how in the world can you handle an upset coach, especially one that happens to be right?

DLH17 Mon Jul 12, 2010 03:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 685161)
I don't think the following is "benign" at all:

The above, as stated, shows an obvious lack of consistency that every good official I know strives to avoid. That, along with the post telling about sitting in the stands and yelling at other officials (did you read that, by the way?), tells a lot of us that mutanyducky is a little lacking in the skills needed to become a good official.

Maybe the mutant mallard one was actually wanting to say what Camron Rust posted, about different situations in different games sometimes warrant different actions. Maybe the post about sitting in the stands was actually about being around a bunch of friends during the neighborhood driveway pickup game, and everyone was yucking it up. But that's not what was communicated, and communication is a big part of being a good official. So, either mutantducky is a poor communicator, or (s)he actually described what they did during actual games, which would also be the sign of an official that needs improvement.

Jurassic's post may have come across as a little blunt, but it usually comes as a result of many, many, many, many (ok, a lot of) years of experience, and he usually knows his stuff. Call it his version of tough love. But if his posts really bother you, how in the world can you handle an upset coach, especially one that happens to be right?
I hear what you are saying about JR. However, I'd rather read something that demonstrates his experience level regarding a legit OP instead of watching him chop a guy off below the knees that he doesn't see fit to tolerate. And, it doesn't really matter if he thinks mutantducky should sit in the stands and cheer full time. That's why there's an "ignore" feature. It would probably be worth his time to utilize it instead of flaming.

If he doesn't care to associate or work with him, then why in the heck does he care to respond to his posts?


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