Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 681020)

If that is the case then none of us should ever officiate. That is life. Things in life can always be misconstrued, but that does not mean that one interaction is going to be the end all be all in someone's career. We are talking about one play here that was talked about. I do not think anyone should walk on egg shells to avoid all conflicts of any kind.

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 681020)

I understand this, but this was not apart of the OP. He did not say his partners were in any particular stature other than they were veterans, which probably means they had some experience on him in officiating. Heck you might have a person that has a little experience on someone that has little perspective and they could "run and tell" what happened. We cannot spend all our time worrying about that or it will make us ineffective as officials. All veterans were helped at one time by other veterans when they were younger officials. I just think we should not automatically assume that everyone that has worked longer than you has the interest or the ability to ruin you over one game.

Originally Posted by Pete (Post 681037)

Pregame the event by saying that sometimes I miss behind contact as lead and would appreciate any help from C and T. You will soon learn who is with you and who is not.

Originally Posted by Pete (Post 681037)

It sounds like you were set up by the vets. Lesson learned. Pregame the event by saying that sometimes I miss behind contact as lead and would appreciate any help from C and T. You will soon learn who is with you and who is not.

Originally Posted by deecee (Post 681045)

Generally as a rule of thumb if a bench and the whole crowd react very displeased with an OOB call I look at my partner and ask if he had anything I might have missed (I only do this when for example I am lead and the ball goes OOB opposite side of where I am).

If he did pass on a foul here is where he would tell me if we DO get together and I will change the call myself.

Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 681051)

for the sake of argument, are you really "missing" contact? maybe it's semantics, but, instead of missing that contact, you just didn't see the contact...and, not because you weren't in position or not doing your job. it takes a team to do the job right and cover the angles.

Originally Posted by vbzebra (Post 681057)

I may have been too close to the play, but as they were fighting for the rebound in that quick tip second, i was looking up top to see who tipped it last. This is where my partner said B1 was 'over the back' of A1, causing A1 to touch it last. Said he was hoping i'd give the ball back to A1, to 'save B1 a foul'.

Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 681061)

Exactly. I'm tracking with you, vbz. Which is the reason I'm not telling everyone in pre-game that I might "miss" some contact.

No way do I say it that way. Rather, I say something similar to this, "my partners and I will be working as a team to catch as much illegal contact as possible.".

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 681065)

Wait a second, are you talking about the pregame meeting with the coaches? :eek:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 681028)

Knowing what to say, how to say it, and to whom to say it are important traits no matter what part of life we're discussing. It's also different than walking on egg shells.

Here is the relevant comment from the OP: "questioning seasoned veterans (a no no on our board when working with certain vets)."

I took this to mean that this group was, essentially, part of my #3 above. It doesn't mean the OP shouldn't or couldn't have probed deeper, but I think it does imply that he needs to be professional in how he brings it up. As scrapper points out, there are ways to do this by bringing it back upon yourself. For me, I can still use the "I just want to know how it's done here" card. In the OP, I could have said, "I just want to know how you guys do it so I'm consistent, but I was taught to come in with a foul in that situation. Are you saying it's expected to wait until the lead asks for help on this play?"

Maybe it shouldn't be that way, but sometimes it just is.

Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 681077)

I thought that is what the other poster was implying since the angry B coach was part of the discussion.

I would choose not to say the words "I might miss some contact" no matter who I'm talking to....partners or otherwise. DEF NOT a coach, at any time.

Originally Posted by DLH17 (Post 681061)

"my partners and I will be working as a team to catch as much illegal contact as possible.".

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 681084)

All I am saying is you cannot officiate in fear. You have to officiate as if you are just as good as the people you are dealing with. If there is a conflict, handle it professionally. And if there is a conflict, then know your place in that conflict. That is why the term "silence cannot be quoted" works in so many areas. But not talking about the play honestly is not good IMO. And I think stature of an official is based more on accomplishment then simply years of experience. We have many guys that have been around for 20 years but cannot work a playoff game. I would be more concerned about butting heads with the state final/college official than just a guy that I worked with that has been doing this for 15 years.

Peace

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 681085)

Personally, if I'm talking to other officials, it really goes without saying. I don't even get into that arena with coaches in a game setting, though. I wouldn't even say the following to a coach:



It's almost as bad as listing the year's POEs and saying you're watching for them.