[NFHS] Is there room for judgement on this

[SperlingPE]

High school varsity contest.
Under one minute to play.
Team A is inbounding in the back court
Team B is down by 6.
Center calls a foul on Team B after the ball is at the disposal of the inbounder for Team A and before the ball is inbounded.

I thought by rule that this is an intentional foul.
I did not see exactly what the center saw so I cannot comment on what conspired to elicit the whistle.

Is there any room for judgement on this call? Has anyone been instructed by your associations to exercise judgement in this situation?

I have not heard any comments on this particular situation at any association meetings or from any newsletters. I will be contacting the association for information to be ready for this if it comes up in a game that I am officaiting. I want to know if there has been discussion elsewhere.

[BayStateRef]

No rule requires this to be an intentional foul. It is always up to the official's judgment. A defensive player could be called for holding an offensive player who is trying to get free for the pass. It need not be intentional.

I have called this a common foul many times...early in the game and late in the game. The player's action determines if it is intentional.

[just another ref]

Plenty of room for judgment, in my opinion. This is not intentional by rule. It is merely an example which is frequently given of when an intentional foul may be called.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by SperlingPE

Center calls a foul on Team B after the ball is at the disposal of the inbounder for Team A and before the ball is inbounded.

I thought by rule that this is an intentional foul.

I think where you're getting confused is the NF rule regarding contact during a dead ball. When the ball is at the disposal of the inbounder, the ball becomes live at that point, even though there is no team control. Just because there's no team control at that point, it doesn't mean there's a dead ball and you can still have a common foul call.

[SperlingPE]

Originally Posted by BayStateRef

No rule requires this to be an intentional foul. It is always up to the official's judgment. A defensive player could be called for holding an offensive player who is trying to get free for the pass. It need not be intentional.

I have called this a common foul many times...early in the game and late in the game. The player's action determines if it is intentional.

agreed after re-reading the case book.

[Nevadaref]

There is no rule which mandates that any foul committed during a throw-in has to be intentional, but it certainly may be called such. Here is the latest guidance from the NFHS on these plays:

2006-07 POINTS OF EMPHASIS
#4
Intentional Fouls. The committee continues to be concerned about how games end. While there has been some improvement in the application of the rule, there is still need for further understanding and enforcement. An intentional foul is a personal or technical foul that neutralizes an opponent's obvious advantageous position. Contact away from the ball or when not making a legitimate attempt to play the ball or player, specifically designed to stop or keep the clock from starting, shall be intentional. Intentional fouls may or may not be premeditated and are not based solely on the severity of the act. A foul also shall be ruled intentional if while playing the ball a player causes excessive contact with an opponent.

Fouling is an accepted coaching strategy late in the game. There is a right way and a wrong way to foul. Coaches must instruct their players in the proper technique for strategic fouling. "Going for the ball" is a common phrase heard, but intentional fouls should still be called on players who go for the ball if it is not done properly.

Additionally, in throw-in situations, fouling a player that is not involved in the play in any way (setting a screen, attempting to receive the in-bound pass, etc. ) must be deemed intentional. Far too often, officials do not call fouls as intentional when the act clearly meets the criteria.

[SperlingPE]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

There is no rule which mandates that any foul committed during a throw-in has to be intentional, but it certainly may be called such. Here is the latest guidance from the NFHS on these plays:

2006-07 POINTS OF EMPHASIS
#4
Intentional Fouls. The committee continues to be concerned about how games end. While there has been some improvement in the application of the rule, there is still need for further understanding and enforcement. An intentional foul is a personal or technical foul that neutralizes an opponent's obvious advantageous position. Contact away from the ball or when not making a legitimate attempt to play the ball or player, specifically designed to stop or keep the clock from starting, shall be intentional. Intentional fouls may or may not be premeditated and are not based solely on the severity of the act. A foul also shall be ruled intentional if while playing the ball a player causes excessive contact with an opponent.

Fouling is an accepted coaching strategy late in the game. There is a right way and a wrong way to foul. Coaches must instruct their players in the proper technique for strategic fouling. "Going for the ball" is a common phrase heard, but intentional fouls should still be called on players who go for the ball if it is not done properly.

Additionally, in throw-in situations, fouling a player that is not involved in the play in any way (setting a screen, attempting to receive the in-bound pass, etc. ) must be deemed intentional. Far too often, officials do not call fouls as intentional when the act clearly meets the criteria.

Well, I thought I had read something along the above.
However, as stated in the OP, I did not see what happened to cause the foul to be called. The act may have been a legitimate attempt to play the ball or player

[Juulie Downs]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

There is no rule which mandates that any foul committed during a throw-in has to be intentional, but it certainly may be called such.

Unless it's committed against the person throwing the ball in! OP didn't specifically say it was away from the ball.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by Juulie Downs

Unless it's committed against the person throwing the ball in! OP didn't specifically say it was away from the ball.

I think Juulie hit the nail right on the head here. If the foul occurred after the ball was at the disposal of the inbounder but before the inbound pass was made, it's a pretty safe bet the inbounder was fouled which, by rule, is an intentional foul. The OP said he did not see what the official saw, so this probably was it. The only thing that doesn't fit this is that the C made the call.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

I think Juulie hit the nail right on the head here. If the foul occurred after the ball was at the disposal of the inbounder but before the inbound pass was made, it's a pretty safe bet the inbounder was fouled which, by rule, is an intentional foul. The OP said he did not see what the official saw, so this probably was it. The only thing that doesn't fit this is that the C made the call.

The fact that the OP said he didn't see the actual foul leads me to believe it was not the inbounder who was fouled. Everyone is watching the thrower on this play.

Further, the part in red is not necessarily true. It is not the nature of the player (inbounder or thrower) that causes this to be intentional, it's the location of the contact with respect to the OOB plane.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Further, the part in red is not necessarily true. It is not the nature of the player (inbounder or thrower) that causes this to be intentional, it's the location of the contact with respect to the OOB plane.

Yes, and also whether the ball has been released.

[SperlingPE]

The foul was not comitted on the inbounding Team A player.
The foul was committed by Team B on a Team A player away from the ball.

[tjchamp]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

The fact that the OP said he didn't see the actual foul leads me to believe it was not the inbounder who was fouled. Everyone is watching the thrower on this play.

Further, the part in red is not necessarily true. It is not the nature of the player (inbounder or thrower) that causes this to be intentional, it's the location of the contact with respect to the OOB plane.

I want to make sure I understand this correctly. After a made basket, the throw in team has a second person OOB, maybe waiting to receive a pass (not the thrower at this point). If a defender fouls this non-thrower, are we to call an intentional foul on this, or could we call a common foul. 9-3-10P4 indicates: If an opponent(s) of the thrower reaches through the throw-in boundaryline plane and fouls the thrower, an intentional personal foul shall be charged to the offender. No warning for delay required.

[Adam]

I'd say on an end line throw-in, any offensive player standing outside of the appropriate end line is a "thrower."

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I'd say on an end line throw-in, any offensive player standing outside of the appropriate end line is a "thrower."

4-42-1: The thrower is the player who attempts to make the throw-in.

If he doesn't have the ball, he is not attempting to make the throw-in.