Sub never reported during TO

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bbcof83

So last night we're coming out of a TO 3 mins into the game. Players line up for a throw-in on the endline. As my partner is handing the ball to the thrower, I see the scorer waving at me to come over. I get on my whistle and approach the table. He says "35 white never reported into the game." I asked to be sure "he never came to the table and no coaches reported for him?" No is the answer. I am now thinking "great, this has never happened to me before. What do we do?"

Put 35 white back at the table and move on, correct?

What level?

By rule, you have an illegal sub, T on #35.

[slow whistle]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

What level?

By rule, you have an illegal sub, T on #35.

What about casebook 3.3.3 sit B - once a player enters, even illegally and the ball becomes live there is no provision for penalizing?

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by slow whistle

What about casebook 3.3.3 sit B - once a player enters, even illegally and the ball becomes live there is no provision for penalizing?

It's not clear in the OP whether the ball actually became live. If it did, no penalty, resume with the throw-in. If it didn't, by rule you have the technical foul.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

it's not clear in the op whether the ball actually became live. If it did, no penalty, resume with the throw-in. If it didn't, by rule you have the technical foul.

+1

[slow whistle]

Agree with both of you, I assumed he had the ball, but we don't know. Still wondering about the handing of the ball.

[slow whistle]

This is sort of a fine line though no? At what point do you penalize? Say they are breaking the timeout huddle and the illegal sub gets halfway to the free throw lane and remembers that he didn't report so he goes to the table (and would have to stay until next opportunity to sub)? Is he illegally on the floor then? Or are we saying that once the official is ready to administer the free throw, between that point and the time the ball becomes live, there is your window to penalize?

[bbcof83]

Originally Posted by slow whistle

Agree with both of you, I assumed he had the ball, but we don't know. Still wondering about the handing of the ball.

Clarification. It was boys varsity. The ball was not yet at the thrower's disposal. It was a throw-in for white on the end-line under their basket. So partner was about to hand the ball to white.

What we did: We got together, discussed, T'd white bench, indirect to head coach, black ball at mid court. But after the game we were thinking we totally kicked it because in the rules it says a substitute becomes a player once the clock starts. So we were thinking we should have just sent the kid back to the table and brought back out the kid who was subbed.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bbcof83

Clarification. It was boys varsity. The ball was not yet at the thrower's disposal. It was a throw-in for white on the end-line under their basket. So partner was about to hand the ball to white.

What we did: We got together, discussed, T'd white bench, indirect to head coach, black ball at mid court. But after the game we were thinking we totally kicked it because in the rules it says a substitute becomes a player once the clock starts. So we were thinking we should have just sent the kid back to the table and brought back out the kid who was subbed.

The sub was on the court without being beckoned or reporting, it's a T to the player that does not include an indirect on the coach. It's a sub T in the summary chart.

If you hadn't caught it until the ball became live, it would have been too late.

At any high school level (Freshman and above), I'd call this T without blinking. At ms and below, I'd consider sending him to the table, depending on the prevailing practice in that particular area/league.

[bbcof83]

OK, 10-2 makes it pretty clear:

A sub shall not enter the court:
Art 1. Without reporting to the scorer.
Art 2. Without being beckoned by an official, except between quarters.
PENALTY: Two FTs plus the ball for a division line throw in. One foul for either or both requirements. Penalized if discovered before the ball becomes live.