Time-out Debacle

[NewNCref]

Had a great VB game last night. With Team A down by 4, Team B has the ball in their front court, and is under pressure near the division line. I am trail, on the division line table side, and about 10 feet out on the floor to see the action right near the division line. B1 has possession of the ball, and I hear what I believe to be B's coach requesting a time out. I glance over to see B's coach, and he is in fact requesting a time-out, both visually and verbally. I blow my whistle to grant Team B a time-out. When I immediately hear an uproar in the rather crowded gym, and in the time it took me to glance at Team B's coach, B1 has committed a turnover, and A1 is now in player control. I sell it hard that B1 had possession when time-out was requested, and grant the time-out, and give the ball back to Team B.

A couple of questions about the situation.

1.) Was I, by rule, correct in what I did? Since B1 had control of the ball when time-out was requested, the time-out was granted and the ball given back to Team B.

2.) Could I have been in a better position to officiate this play and see the coach's request for time-out?

[NEohioref]

My turn to answer this one. You answered your own question.B has possesion, you heard B's coach call timeout ,you glanced over over and seen it was team B's coach you blow your whistle and grant the timeout. In my book your good! W.W.D.D(What Would Diebler Do?)

[biggravy]

Don't sweat it. Let's say you don't look, you blow your whistle just as B1 jumps straight up and throws a rocket pass to B2 under the hoop for an easy 2. Now coach B is screaming "I didn't want a timeout!". You can't win 'em all. Still, it's another good example of why coaches shouldn't be able to call timeout, imo.

[StripesOhio]

Where was your partner? Didn't he see or hear the coach yelling for timeout? If you were at an angle to not see the bench for clarification he should have helped you out.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by NEohioref

My turn to answer this one. You answered your own question.B has possesion, you heard B's coach call request timeout ,you glanced over over and seen it was team B's coach you blow your whistle and grant the timeout. In my book your good! W.W.D.D(What Would Diebler Do?)

Originally Posted by biggravy

Don't sweat it. Let's say you don't look, you blow your whistle just as B1 jumps straight up and throws a rocket pass to B2 under the hoop for an easy 2. Now coach B is screaming "I didn't want a timeout!". You can't win 'em all. Still, it's another good example of why coaches shouldn't be able to call request timeout, imo.

When coaches are able to call timeout... I think it's time for me to hang it up.

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by NEohioref

My turn to answer this one. You answered your own question.B has possesion, you heard B's coach request timeout ,you glanced over over and seen it was team B's coach you blow your whistle and grant the timeout. In my book your good! W.W.D.D(What Would Diebler Do?)

Originally Posted by biggravy

Don't sweat it. Let's say you don't look, you blow your whistle just as B1 jumps straight up and throws a rocket pass to B2 under the hoop for an easy 2. Now coach B is screaming "I didn't want a timeout!". You can't win 'em all. Still, it's another good example of why coaches shouldn't be able to request timeout, imo.

Originally Posted by tjones1

When coaches are able to request timeout... I think it's time for me to hang it up.

There fixed it for everyone, as the coach can only request a timeout. LMAO

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by chseagle

There fixed it for everyone, as the coach can only request a timeout. LMAO

No need to fix it for me... you must not have read what I wrote.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by NewNCref

Had a great VB game last night. With Team A down by 4, Team B has the ball in their front court, and is under pressure near the division line. I am trail, on the division line table side, and about 10 feet out on the floor to see the action right near the division line. B1 has possession of the ball, and I hear what I believe to be B's coach requesting a time out. I glance over to see B's coach, and he is in fact requesting a time-out, both visually and verbally. I blow my whistle to grant Team B a time-out. When I immediately hear an uproar in the rather crowded gym, and in the time it took me to glance at Team B's coach, B1 has committed a turnover, and A1 is now in player control. I sell it hard that B1 had possession when time-out was requested, and grant the time-out, and give the ball back to Team B.

A couple of questions about the situation.

1.) Was I, by rule, correct in what I did? Since B1 had control of the ball when time-out was requested, the time-out was granted and the ball given back to Team B.

2.) Could I have been in a better position to officiate this play and see the coach's request for time-out?

1. By rule you were not correct. 5-8-3 says that the ball must be in control when the official grants the request. How does an official grant a time-out request? -- By blowing the whistle and stopping the clock. At the time which you did this the opponent had the ball. Now, many people will tell you that by practice officials give the time-out when they are a little slow to respond to the coach's request. Of course, this does cause problems such as the one which you encountered.

2. Two things which could have been done:
a. after seeing that the request is coming from the Head Coach, you could have turned your vision back to the game action and looked to see if his team still had control before blowing your whistle
b. your partner may have had a clear view of both the action and the Head Coach, if so, then he could have granted the time-out request.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

1. By rule you were not correct. 5-8-3 says that the ball must be in control when the official grants the request. How does an official grant a time-out request? -- By blowing the whistle and stopping the clock.

Not according to everybody else in the whole wide world.granting time-out as player goes oob

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by NewNCref

Had a great VB game last night. With Team A down by 4, Team B has the ball in their front court, and is under pressure near the division line. I am trail, on the division line table side, and about 10 feet out on the floor to see the action right near the division line. B1 has possession of the ball, and I hear what I believe to be B's coach requesting a time out. I glance over to see B's coach, and he is in fact requesting a time-out, both visually and verbally. I blow my whistle to grant Team B a time-out. When I immediately hear an uproar in the rather crowded gym, and in the time it took me to glance at Team B's coach, B1 has committed a turnover, and A1 is now in player control. I sell it hard that B1 had possession when time-out was requested, and grant the time-out, and give the ball back to Team B.

A couple of questions about the situation.

1.) Was I, by rule, correct in what I did? Since B1 had control of the ball when time-out was requested, the time-out was granted and the ball given back to Team B.

2.) Could I have been in a better position to officiate this play and see the coach's request for time-out?

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

1. By rule you were not correct. 5-8-3 says that the ball must be in control when the official grants the request. How does an official grant a time-out request? -- By blowing the whistle and stopping the clock. At the time which you did this the opponent had the ball. Now, many people will tell you that by practice officials give the time-out when they are a little slow to respond to the coach's request. Of course, this does cause problems such as the one which you encountered.

2. Two things which could have been done:
a. after seeing that the request is coming from the Head Coach, you could have turned your vision back to the game action and looked to see if his team still had control before blowing your whistle
b. your partner may have had a clear view of both the action and the Head Coach, if so, then he could have granted the time-out request.

NewNC,
These situations seem to happen somewhat frequently -- I witnessed a situation that was even worse than yours last week.

As long as the HEAD COACH can request time outs, we will always have the situations that you describe. I think that conventional wisdom suggests that the calling official error on the side of NOT granting the time out UNTIL the calling official is sure that a PROPER REQUEST was made at a PROPER TIME AND was RECOGNIZED by the calling official at a PROPER TIME.

The best advice I can give is to SELL THE HECK out of your call if a turnover happens between your recognition and the actual SOUNDING of your whistle.

When you report the time out, you can include the explanation of "the player was in control when I recogmized the time out." Regardless what you call in this case, you are going to irritate 50% of the people in the gym. If you grant the timeout, the opposing team will be livid. If you fail to grant the time out ("coach, by the time I realized you wanted the time out, none of your players was in player control"), the requesting team will be livid.

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by tjones1

No need to fix it for me... you must not have read what I wrote.

Actually I did read, I was trying to put in some humor by having the LMAO & emoticon at the end.

Although I have heard officials say "Full timeout called by white coach", instead of "Full timeout requested by white coach granted".

[kwv001]

The worst thing that ever happened was allowing a coach to request a time-out from the bench. If I were king for a day, that is the first thing I would change.

A few years ago, I was working a lower level game with a relatively new official. He heard a loud male voice yelling "time-out" from the direction of the bench. Without turning to look, he blows the whistle to grant the request. Turns out the "request" actually came from the 3rd row of the stands behind the bench!!!

Locally, this is how we handle it, which is essentially how it was handled by the OP. If I have my back to the team bench and hear what I believe to be a time-out request, I will immediately note the game situation (possession, etc.) then turn to the bench to verify the time-out request. If it is the head coach, I will grant the request "retro-active" to when it was heard.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by NewNCref

I am trail, on the division line table side, and about 10 feet out on the floor to see the action right near the division line.


A couple of questions about the situation.
1.) Was I, by rule, correct in what I did? Since B1 had control of the ball when time-out was requested, the time-out was granted and the ball given back to Team B.
2.) Could I have been in a better position to officiate this play and see the coach's request for time-out?

1) Yes. And don't listen to any silly monkey that tells you differently.
2) You were in position to see...and call...what was happening on the floor in your area. What happens outside the boundary line is secondary. You can only do so much with TO requests, given the inherent flaw contained in allowing coaches to request TO's. If the occasional TO request gets screwed up because you didn't want to take your eyes off the play, oh well. Don't sweat it. You'll get yourself in deeper doo-doo if you're watching the sidelines while a dribbler is getting the snot kicked outa him.

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

1) Yes. And don't listen to any silly monkey that tells you differently.
2) You were in position to see...and call...what was happening on the floor in your area. What happens outside the boundary line is secondary. You can only do so much with TO requests, given the inherent flaw contained in allowing coaches to request TO's. If the occasional TO request gets screwed up because you didn't want to take your eyes off the play, oh well. Don't sweat it. You'll get yourself in deeper doo-doo if you're watching the sidelines while a dribbler is getting the snot kicked outa him.

Amen!!!

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by biggravy

Still, it's another good example of why coaches shouldn't be able to call timeout, imo.

Amen.