3 seconds....THREE SECONDS!!!

[Rich]

I'm always amused at the fans who don't understand the nuance of the rule. Like last night when the ball was being shot, rebounded, shot, rebounded....some joker is SCREAMING at the top of his lungs how we apparently can't count to 3. Girls assistant coach thinks the semicircle above the 3 point line is part of the lane. Another fan wants 3 seconds cause "she was in the lane six seconds" even though the ball was never even in the frontcourt for 3.

And in the game before ours (another varsity game in a holiday tournament), when I was sitting back and hearing the stuff from the crowd -- wow, I've never heard such stupidity. And not only are they wrong and stupid, they feel it's necessary, their right, and their duty to scream at the officials the entire game. I swear it wasn't this way just 10 years ago.

Back to 3 second violations -- And yet, I called another one last night. This, folks is FOUR for the season in a dozen games. Don't tell me I don't pay attention to the POEs.

[bbcof83]

I noticed the same thing watching the game ahead of mine at a Christmas tourney yesterday. 3 or 4 guys up in the stands spent the entire game SCREAMING things like you said (CHARGE!, in case you're wondering that was a charge, you're missing a good game ref, shuffling her feet is traveling ref!, etc)

Is it getting worse? How can we turn it around and start improving things?

I feel when the wife and I finally have kids and they start to play ball I'm going to have a real problem sitting anywhere near this lot... Do I educate them? Ignore them? Run away screaming? Yell back with directions on how to be a better fan/parent (know the rules!, it's about your kid not you, everyone would have more fun if you shut your mouth!, etc)?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by bbcof83

I noticed the same thing watching the game ahead of mine at a Christmas tourney yesterday. 3 or 4 guys up in the stands spent the entire game SCREAMING things like you said (CHARGE!, in case you're wondering that was a charge, you're missing a good game ref, shuffling her feet is traveling ref!, etc)

Is it getting worse? How can we turn it around and start improving things?

I feel when the wife and I finally have kids and they start to play ball I'm going to have a real problem sitting anywhere near this lot... Do I educate them? Ignore them? Run away screaming? Yell back with directions on how to be a better fan/parent (know the rules!, it's about your kid not you, everyone would have more fun if you shut your mouth!, etc)?

Sit back and have a good laugh. Nothing else is a good option.

Last night was a pretty bad girls game. Most of the game consisted of players lowering their heads and trying to drive through 3 defenders and everyone (on the offense's side) wondering why we didn't call a foul. Go to the other end -- wash, rinse, repeat.

My favorite play was near halftime -- a 6'3" girl got a rebound and held the ball above and slightly behind her head and a player came from behind and simply took the ball away from her. And people wondered why there wasn't a foul. Duh. She simply had the ball taken from her.

Like I said, if you're in the stands have a nice smile/chuckle and if you're on the court.....well, do the same for the stuff that gets through the idiot filter.

[Back In The Saddle]

Why do so many supposed adults, who have grown beyond those brain-damaged teenage years where we were all convinced that our friends knew everything and the adults knew nothing, why is it they so easily revert to that same mentality at sporting events?

And how is it that a complete stranger sitting two rows in front of mommy and daddy is afforded instant credibility and assumed to be vastly more knowledgeable and observant than the folks in stripes? We really need to figure that one out, and then teach those skills at camps!

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

Why do so many supposed adults, who have grown beyond those brain-damaged teenage years where we were all convinced that our friends knew everything and the adults knew nothing, why is it they so easily revert to that same mentality at sporting events?

And how is it that a complete stranger sitting two rows in front of mommy and daddy is afforded instant credibility and assumed to be vastly more knowledgeable and observant than the folks in stripes? We really need to figure that one out, and then teach those skills at camps!

I had a ball near the sideline last night. I'm right on the line (which is the hardest part of having to bounce between 2 and 3 person for me -- getting to the sideline as the lead official) and the ball had gone off of a home player's foot and was heading out. For some unknown reason, a visiting player reached down and tried to stop the ball and the ball squirted out of her hands and onto the sideline. I signal the violation, and some clown 8 rows up starts yelling:

"How can you miss that? That ball was already out! You're giving it to the wrong team!"

Later, we had a scramble, loose ball, players rolling around, ball's tied up, players roll over, and one ends up on top of the other. No foul, the ball was already tied up, etc. :

"She's got a knee in her back! That's a foul! You guys are terrible! Call something! Somebody's going to get hurt! Oh, the HUMANITY!"

OK, I made the last sentence up. I think.

I could go on and on and on and I tuned about 90% (I'd estimate) out completely. The parents are just complete and total idiots. I'm OK with that, but how about keeping their idiotic opinions to themselves?

[TimTaylor]

Maybe NFHS should require a sign in flashing lights on the gym wall with the Lincoln quote: "It's better to remain silent and thought a fool than open one's mouth and remove all doubt."

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Sit back and have a good laugh. Nothing else is a good option.

Yep, same here at a holiday tourney doubleheader yesterday. The depth of ignorance fueled by sheer favoritism is sinking lower year by year.

Options I've been exercising for about three years now is working out quite well, with my alma mater gym (where I can't do games due to conflict of interest with son playing there also) as a testing laboratory:
1) Avoid sitting by ignorant/boistrous/stupid (IBS) people I know well. This includes a handful of relatives and close friends. When they ask at the concession stand why I sit by myself, away from the crowd, I unashamedly express to them how embarassing it is to sit by them. Have won over several relatives this way.
2) Intentionally sat by two chronic IBS's and, over the course of two years, have won them over to observing the game from the official's point of view. One of the two is even considering donning the stripes for an upcoming season.
3) Stand up annually at parents' pre-season meetings with the coach to express to other parents how ridiculous chronic one-sided, biased, favoritism-fueled complaining is, pleading the case for sportsmanship, explaining how young players begin to play to the whistle as a result of stuff that is shouted from the stands.
4) Make myself available to fans before, during, and after games to explain calls and rules from an official's point of view so as to enhance their understanding
This experiment may not be changing the world, but it is having somewhat an impact at at least one school. And it's working little by little.

And...sometimes I just sit back and laugh.

[Upward ref]

Originally Posted by TimTaylor

Maybe NFHS should require a sign in flashing lights on the gym wall with the Lincoln quote: "It's better to remain silent and thought a fool than open one's mouth and remove all doubt."

disregarding that advice myself right now ! all the high schools put out sportsmanship rules of behavior , booing, cursing, etc. seems like they should eject some of the biggest mouths a few times for the worst stuff. my son and i left the home team side last night and sat across the gym because imo they are notorious for their big mouth opinions, and really embarassing to be around . even though the team went all the way last year.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Upward ref

disregarding that advice myself right now ! all the high schools put out sportsmanship rules of behavior , booing, cursing, etc. seems like they should eject some of the biggest mouths a few times for the worst stuff. my son and i left the home team side last night and sat across the gym because imo they are notorious for their big mouth opinions, and really embarassing to be around . even though the team ( Tabb H.S., York Co. Va.) went all the way last year.

The ultimate combination: ignorance + bias + no self control + an entitlement complex.

[Refk]

I don't think it works to try to educate unless you know them personally. .......... last year watching a game prior to my daughter's. Official calls backcourt violation- player jumped from back court, caught pass from teammate in front court (still in air). This guys goes nuts ..... turns to me and says " can you believe that ; where are they getting theses guys, they are HORRIBLE ". He had been obnoxious the whole game so instead of just keeping my mouth shut I said (nicely) that these two officials are probably two of the best in the area and that they got the call right. He reallly didnt' like that and the conversation just went down hill....... got to the point where he was getting personal with me and we ended up having a few choice words. I walked away .............. tough to do and vowed NEVER to try and educate someone I don't know.

[just another ref]

Last night BV, team A pressed most of the night. Team B had a lot of success breaking the press and scoring. There were a lot of near miss block attempts and I think A players must have slapped the backboard at least a half dozen times. Each time, the same very helpful voice was heard:

"That's a tech! He can't slap the backboard!"

[eg-italy]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I'm always amused at the fans who don't understand the nuance of the rule. Like last night when the ball was being shot, rebounded, shot, rebounded....some joker is SCREAMING at the top of his lungs how we apparently can't count to 3. Girls assistant coach thinks the semicircle above the 3 point line is part of the lane. Another fan wants 3 seconds cause "she was in the lane six seconds" even though the ball was never even in the frontcourt for 3.

Just today: team B steals the ball in their backcourt; B1 dribbles towards their frontcourt, but loses the ball just after having crossed the division line; A1 catches the ball and immediately passes it to A2 who was still in the paint; A2 is guarded by B2, so he passes the ball out to a teammate who shots and scores.

"Three seconds! He has been in the paint for a long time!" a person screams and repeats it many times.

Unfortunately he was not in the bleachers, but in front of a bench; yes, he was team B's coach. Even forgetting that the ball acquired frontcourt status only when A2 touched it, the entire play by team A was not more that a couple of seconds long.

The young officials I was assisting did not T the coach. They T'd him later.

Nice tourney (thirteen year old boys), good basketball, fairly good officiating by 16-18 year old officials (with instructors to assist them from the table, talking with them during time-outs). And there were interesting conversations with coaches about basketball officiating: many of them were eager to know from us what we are saying to the officials and to discuss calls in a friendly manner. Maybe sometimes first with a complaint, but usually understanding the explanations we instructors gave, even during play.

Ciao

[Cobra]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

The parents are just complete and total idiots. I'm OK with that, but how about keeping their idiotic opinions to themselves?

The big question is why does society allow this type of behavior? If those people were to yell and act like that at any other location in our society it would be thought of as completely improper. All of a sudden they go to a youth sporting event and society no longer looks down on that type of behavior.

Some people who don't act like idiots the entire game sit right next to people who do, yet they do not think anything of it when the idiot screams for an hour straight. Why does society not look down upon this type of behavior?

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

The ultimate combination: ignorance + bias + no self control + an entitlement complex.

Are you talking about Congress?

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by eg-italy

"Three seconds! He has been in the paint for a long time!" a person screams and repeats it many times.

My personal favorite reply to this kind of a statement by a coach: "Coach, that wasn't three seconds even in dog years."

All of you have my permission to use it. I own the copyright.