Throw-in Spot

[Steverz]

Would someone please show "exactly" where in the Rule or Caseplay book the answer to this simple question that our association started throwing around.

Caseplay: Along the endline in the backcourt, A1 inbounds the ball. No other players are paying attention and the ball eventually rolls out-of-bounds along the sideline without ever being touched. Where does Team B have the ball for a throw-in?

They are saying the throw-in is where the ball went out-of-bounds, not where it was originally inbounded even though no player touched the ball. Which is it since I can't seem to locate it in the books?

Thanks

[Back In The Saddle]

"The ball shall be passed by the thrower directly into the court from out-of-bounds so it touches or is touched by another player (inbounds or out of bounds) on the court before going out of bounds untouched." (NFHS 9-2-2)

"PENALTY: (Section 2) The ball becomes dead when the violation or technical foul occurs. Following a violation, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throw-in at the original throw-in spot."

This is a throw-in violation, not an out of bounds violation. The penalty spot for a throw-in violation is the spot of the original throw-in.

[Steverz]

HI: I do recall reading what you wrote about the rule in the book (not the penalty portion though). The association leaders are saying that the ball is supposed to be thorwn-in where the ball went out-of-bounds while I have been inbounding the ball at the original thow-in spot. I had a feeling I was right but just couldn't remember where it was in the book. THANKS.

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by Steverz

Would someone please show "exactly" where in the Rule or Caseplay book the answer to this simple question that our association started throwing around.

Caseplay: Along the endline in the backcourt, A1 inbounds the ball. No other players are paying attention and the ball eventually rolls out-of-bounds along the sideline without ever being touched. Where does Team B have the ball for a throw-in?

They are saying the throw-in is where the ball went out-of-bounds, not where it was originally inbounded even though no player touched the ball. Which is it since I can't seem to locate it in the books?

Thanks

Questions for you:
1. When does a throw-in end?
2. If the throw-in did not end, was there a violation?
3. If there was a violation on the throw-in, where did the violation occur?
4. When there is a violation, how is the throw-in spot determined?
HINT: Where does a subsequent throw-in take place if a throw-in wedges between the backboard and the rim and becomes lodged directly from the throw-in?

[BktBallRef]

When there's a violation, you have to ask yourself "who committed the violation?". In this case, it was the thrower, so the ball goes back to where he was at.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Steverz

Would someone please show "exactly" where in the Rule or Caseplay book the answer to this simple question that our association started throwing around.

Caseplay: Along the endline in the backcourt, A1 inbounds the ball. No other players are paying attention and the ball eventually rolls out-of-bounds along the sideline without ever being touched. Where does Team B have the ball for a throw-in?

They are saying the throw-in is where the ball went out-of-bounds, not where it was originally inbounded even though no player touched the ball. Which is it since I can't seem to locate it in the books?

Thanks

I must admit, I'm surprised an association with, I'm guessing, more than a handful of officials would not know this one.

I was working a Varsity game last year and B1 kicks the ball under A's basket, whistle is blown immediately and official signals a kicked ball as it rolls out of bounds on opposite endline, where he signals the spot throw-in shall take place. It took a huddle to convince him he was wrong.

Brain fart as he's a good official.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by fullor30

I must admit, I'm surprised an association with, I'm guessing, more than a handful of officials would not know this one.

I was working a Varsity game last year and B1 kicks the ball under A's basket, whistle is blown immediately and official signals a kicked ball as it rolls out of bounds on opposite endline, where he signals the spot throw-in shall take place. It took a huddle to convince him he was wrong.

Brain fart as he's a good official.

It's like the backcourt violation, people tend to want to inbound it at the division line regardless of where it was touched.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

It's like the backcourt violation, people tend to want to inbound it at the division line regardless of where it was touched.

Hadn't thought about that nor have I seen it kicked lately. Usually, BC happens at or near division line it seems to me.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by fullor30

Hadn't thought about that nor have I seen it kicked lately. Usually, BC happens at or near division line it seems to me.

It's been a while, but I've seen it kicked occasionally. I have never seen an official kick the OP though.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

It's been a while, but I've seen it kicked occasionally. I have never seen an official kick the OP though.

It's one of those calls that everyone wants to let you know where the spot is, as if you don't.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by fullor30

It's one of those calls that everyone wants to let you know where the spot is, as if you don't.

We had it Monday, and silence from the visiting team could almost be heard over the roar of the crowd and home coach.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

Questions for you:
1. When does a throw-in end?
2. If the throw-in did not end, was there a violation?
3. If there was a violation on the throw-in, where did the violation occur?
4. When there is a violation, how is the throw-in spot determined?
HINT: Where does a subsequent throw-in take place if a throw-in wedges between the backboard and the rim and becomes lodged directly from the throw-in?

CMH...great reply to the OP. For a relative new guy like me, seeing an answer to a sitch given back in that form...asking the pertinent questions...is a great way to not only learn the correct application of the rule in a game situation..but to also understand the logic&reasoning of the rule.
I know this will help me on any throw-in questions that may appear on my 2nd year writtten exam that I'm taking next week.
Nice job.
KJump

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

It's like the backcourt violation, people tend to want to inbound it at the division line regardless of where it was touched.

Originally Posted by fullor30

Hadn't thought about that nor have I seen it kicked lately. Usually, BC happens at or near division line it seems to me.

fullor30,
You are correct in MOST cases, BUT the typical case Shaqs is talking about is the case where a ball is directed into the backcourt off of the offensive team -- frequently a ball bounding off a knee or foot well into the backcourt or a last-touch-first-touch that deflects well into the backcourt.

In many situations, the offensive player will attempt to shield the ball hoping that the defender will touch the ball allowing the offensive player to legally regain possession. During this time, the ball continues to roll or bounce away from the division line. In some cases, the ball is not illegally touched by the offensive team until the ball is well into the backcourt.

[Adam]

Exactly. Had one of those (almost two) ther night. My partner correctly spotted the first. The second would have been mine and I was ready to spot it on the endline, but the offense just let it go out of bounds to run as much time as possible off the clock.

Occasionally, you'll see a player hustle all the way to the end line to hit the ball hoping the throwin will be at the division line for a BC violation.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

"The ball shall be passed by the thrower directly into the court from out-of-bounds so it touches or is touched by another player (inbounds or out of bounds) on the court before going out of bounds untouched." (NFHS 9-2-2) "PENALTY: (Section 2) The ball becomes dead when the violation or technical foul occurs. Following a violation, the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throw-in at the original throw-in spot."
This is a throw-in violation, not an out of bounds violation. The penalty spot for a throw-in violation is the spot of the original throw-in.

Keep in mind that if the ball goes directly from the throwin and contacts a player who is out of bounds, then that out of bounds player caused the ball to go out of bounds and the other team will inbound from the out of bounds spot.

(Unless you're as old as Mark T. DeNucci, Sr., in which case the player throwing in the ball caused it to go out of bounds, but that was a very, very, very long time ago, and Dr. Naismith has changed the rules since then.)