Over and Back?

[curtstrouth]

I am 90% sure on this but have someone trying to convince me otherwise. Here is the situation....

Player A is dribbling the ball from the backcourt into the frontcourt. She picks up her dribble while straddeling the halfcourt line (she now has her left foot and the ball in the front court and right foot in the backcourt) She proceeds to pick up her foot that is in the backcourt and then puts it back down. Is this considered over and back?

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by curtstrouth

Is this considered over and back?

Yup.

Whichever of you thinks it's not a violation is probably thinking that you have to get all "three points" into the frontcourt before the violation can be called. But that only applies to a dribbler, not to a player holding the ball.

[ma_ref]

Originally Posted by curtstrouth

She picks up her dribble while straddeling the halfcourt line (she now has her left foot and the ball in the front court and right foot in the backcourt) She proceeds to pick up her foot that is in the backcourt and then puts it back down. Is this considered over and back?

Although it doesn't change the ruling for the play, for rule-technicality-sake, the ball still has back court status at this point in time. Just because the ball may be being held on the FC side of the division line doesn't matter. The fact that she still has 1 foot in the BC makes the ball have BC status too...

[Amesman]

Originally Posted by ma_ref

Although it doesn't change the ruling for the play, for rule-technicality-sake, the ball still has back court status at this point in time. Just because the ball may be being held on the FC side of the division line doesn't matter. The fact that she still has 1 foot in the BC makes the ball have BC status too...

... but only until she picks up that remaining backcourt foot, right?

[Indianaref]

BACKCOURT – FRONTCOURT – BALL LOCATION
4.4.1 SITUATION: As Team A is advancing the ball from its backcourt toward its frontcourt, A1 passes the ball to A2. A2 catches the ball while both feet are on the floor – with one foot on either side of the division line. In this situation, either foot may be the pivot foot. (a) A2 lifts the foot which is in the backcourt and then puts it back on the floor in the backcourt; or (b) A2 lifts the foot which is in the frontcourt, pivots and puts it on the floor in the backcourt. RULING: In (a), it is a backcourt violation. When A2, while holding the ball, lifts the foot which was in the backcourt, the ball is now in the frontcourt. When A2's foot then touches in the backcourt, it is a violation. In (b), when A2 lifts the foot which is in the frontcourt and places it down in the backcourt, the location of the ball has not changed. The ball is still in the backcourt and no violation has occurred. (4-35-2)

[curtstrouth]

So you technically need all 3 points to be considered in the front court only as a dribbler correct? If you pick up the ball you only need the one foot to have front court status while stratteling the division line.

[jdmara]

Originally Posted by curtstrouth

So you technically need all 3 points to be considered in the front court only as a dribbler correct? If you pick up the ball you only need the one foot to have front court status while stratteling the division line.

While dribbling, all "3 points" much be in the front court...yes

If not dribbling, once you have something in the frontcount and NOTHING in the backcourt, you are considered to be in the front court.

-Josh

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Amesman

... but only until she picks up that remaining backcourt foot, right?

Correct. Once that foot came up, the ball now has FC status. When the foot re-touched the BC, the ball then had BC status: violation.

[ma_ref]

Originally Posted by Amesman

... but only until she picks up that remaining backcourt foot, right?

Correct. At that point, both she and the ball have established themselves in the FC. Think of another situation: I'm standing near a sideline. I hold the ball over the line a good 2-3 feet. That doesn't mean the ball is OOB...

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by curtstrouth

So you technically need all 3 points to be considered in the front court only as a dribbler correct? If you pick up the ball you only need the one foot to have front court status while stratteling the division line.

Correct.

If you pick up the ball, then the status of the ball follow player location. If any part of the player is touching the BC, the ball, while being held (such as picking up a dribble, or receiving a pass), is also in the BC. If NO parts of a player are in his/her BC, AND at least 1 part is in the FC, then the ball has FC status.

[williebfree]

Originally Posted by curtstrouth

If you pick up the ball you only need the one foot to have front court status while straddling the division line.

Not correct....
The backcourt foot maintains BC status while in contact with the BC (therefore so does player/ball location remain BC), until the BC foot is lifted. At this point FC status occurs.

You are where you where, until you get where you are going.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by williebfree

You are where you where, until you get where you are going.

You are where you are, until you get where you're going.

[williebfree]

Originally Posted by grunewar

You are where you are, until you get where you're going.

Thanks grunewar... it didn't seem quite right when I typed it, but I let her fly and was prudently reproached.

[Ref_in_Alberta]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Yup.

Whichever of you thinks it's not a violation is probably thinking that you have to get all "three points" into the frontcourt before the violation can be called. But that only applies to a dribbler, not to a player holding the ball.

Ditto in FIBA