He wasn't set!!

[bbcoach7]

I've just about given up encouraging my players to take a charge. Around here (NorCal), it seems like the ONLY time it's ever a charge call is if the defender was clearly stationary such as on the sideline in a trap situation when the dribbler doesn't stop and just goes through the defender.

I'm not going to teach something that is always called a block and just gets us in foul trouble.

One word answer to any response- v i d e o

[mutantducky]

I've noticed in two man crew it can be tough to see if a play is a charge or a block depending what else is going on. I've called a good deal of charges but they can be tricky plays especially on half-court sets.

[bbcoach7]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

I've noticed in two man crew it can be tough to see if a play is a charge or a block depending what else is going on. I've called a good deal of charges but they can be tricky plays especially on half-court sets.

Never thought about that. See, I come here and I learn about basketball. I think it would be great if all coaches had to come to this site and read the threads. One caveat- they can only read -can't post- for like at least 18 months.

I guess if it's not real clear, but there was clearly a lot of contact, the inclination would be to make the block call.

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by bbcoach7

I've just about given up encouraging my players to take a charge. Around here (NorCal), it seems like the ONLY time it's ever a charge call is if the defender was clearly stationary such as on the sideline in a trap situation when the dribbler doesn't stop and just goes through the defender.

I'm not going to teach something that is always called a block and just gets us in foul trouble.

One word answer to any response- v i d e o

Coach, apparently you coach in the wrong state (geographically speaking). During a Boys Varsity game earlier in the year, we had five Player Control Fouls and only one Blocking Foul (in the six true Block/Charge scenarios during the course of the game). Officials referee the defense. If the defender obtains a legal guarding position, maintain that legal guarding position and the contact is initiated by the offense into the defender's torso, we are going the other way.

[Forksref]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

I totally and completely disagree.

If a fellow official is wrong. EXPLAIN IT TO HIM! If he still doesn't get it, EXPLAIN IT AGAIN!

Guys like this make all of our jobs more difficult. When they say something stupid and we don't attempt to correct them, we only add to the problem!

I was working 2-man a couple years ago and my partner raised his eyebrows and gave a funny look after I made a call. Now, this guy was supposed to be one of the best in the area (especially in his mind) and he gives me disapproving looks during the game. I never said anything but I learned that some who are perceived as good officials are not exactly team players. He definitely did not make it easy for his partner to work with him.

What I thought of was WHY was he looking into my area?

[mbyron]

We have an assigner and instructor in our area who's teaching incorrectly. He wants a block when the defender has LGP and steps back to absorb the impact of an opponent. His rationale: "he gave up his spot on the floor."

Probably too late to address the issue this season in an association meeting...

[Forksref]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

I've noticed in two man crew it can be tough to see if a play is a charge or a block depending what else is going on. I've called a good deal of charges but they can be tricky plays especially on half-court sets.

I know this won't sound good coming from a long-time official, but I have a generalization about all sports: The offense gets away with murder.

I agree with you, I wish coaches were required to know the rules. In our state all head coaches are required to take the rules test, BUT they are not required to pass it. And, of course, all the other coaches are not required to take the test, so we have 90% of coaches who never have looked at a rule book. I think coaches should take the test and if they pass the test, then they receive a "license" to discuss rules during the game. That license is a patch on their shirt or a card that they show to the officials prior to the game. If you don't have a license, then you are not allowed to question calls or rulings. One poster had a good one last fall in the FB forum: "I'll talk to you about it coach if you can tell me what color the rule book is this year."

[mick]

Originally Posted by mbyron

We have an assigner and instructor in our area who's teaching incorrectly. He wants a block when the defender has LGP and steps back to absorb the impact of an opponent. His rationale: "he gave up his spot on the floor."

Probably too late to address the issue this season in an association meeting...

Lord Byron,
Had one of these a few nights ago.
I passed on the call, because by the time the defender, who had perfect position, stepped back [and kinda flopped], there wasn't enough contact to call.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by just another ref

How so? Defender is sliding to maintain his LGP. Dribbler picks up his dribble and jumps into him, trying to draw a foul. Defender continues to slide, parallel to the dribbler's original path.

I'm referring to 4-23-4b
Guarding an opponent with the ball or a stationary opponent without the ball:
If the opponent with the ball is airborne, the guard must have obtained legal position before the opponent left the floor..

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by mbyron

we have an assigner and instructor in our area who's teaching incorrectly. He wants a block when the defender has lgp and steps back to absorb the impact of an opponent. His rationale: "he gave up his spot on the floor."

probably too late to address the issue this season in an association meeting...

wow!

[ref2coach]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Just wait until Jurassic gets here and sees that guy's advice to you concerning the crowd's reaction to calls.

Unfortunately I do not think "Jurassic will get here". In one of his posts day before yesterday he objected to the OOO comments of a moderator and said he was "out of here"

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by mick

Lord Byron,
Had one of these a few nights ago.
I passed on the call, because by the time the defender, who had perfect position, stepped back [and kinda flopped], there wasn't enough contact to call.

That's a good no-call, Sir Mick. My complaint concerns the play where the dribbler goes right through the defender's chest, and this instructor is telling people to call a block because the defender (with LGP) took a step back.

[Man In Blue]

Remember if you call everyone a block you will get a high score from coaches for being "consistent". Whatever that means.

[mick]

Originally Posted by Man In Blue

Remember if you call everyone a block you will get a high score from coaches for being "consistent". Whatever that means.

Ha!
Had one of those inconsistent calls last week.

Post player gives a fake to send the defender straight up in the air.
While the defender was in the air, the post player steps about 30" under the hanging defender and, gravity being what it is, the defender comes down on the post player with the ball.
The fans weren't really comfortable with my player control foul.

[WestfordRef]

I had same situation in a game a while back, GV, on a one on one fast break drive to the basket. The home coach literally jumped 2 feet in the air, arms extended, yelling, "She wasn't set"! Fans went bonkers of course. I walked over, and camly explained the rule to her. "Oh, ok, I didn't know that". "Well, coach, great, now can you please explain that to the lynch mob behind you"? And she did.