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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Tue Jan 27, 2009, 01:16pm
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Talking to Pseudo-Coaches

Game last week, see previous thread.

I whacked home HC somewhere into the second quarter. Some guy in a red shirt started pacing around, I figured he's some sort of authority person here, maybe the AD or the Varsity coach. He talked to HC a couple times, when HC needed calming down.

Start of second half, red-shirt-guy was sitting on the bench with players, coaching some, but not a problem in any way. Pretty soon, he started to get up off the bench to coach. Just a little. We ignored it. Pretty soon, he was up off the bench most of the time, coaching, but still not yelling at us. Still he's not the HC, he's been on the bench, and now he was standing and coaching.

So I went over there and quietly and nicely said, "For the purposes of this game, while you're here on the bench and by the bench, you're an assistant coach, and you need to stay seated or leave the bench area." He said, "Oh, I'm not an assistant, I'm the varsity coach." I said, "Okay. You'll be the varsity coach later, but right now, you're an assistant and you need to follow the rules for assistant coaches, which is to stay seated on the bench." He says, "Oh, I know the rules." I said, "Okay great." Behavior didn't change at all.

I said to my partner, "What about this guy?" Partner said, "Well, we'll give one more warning if we get the chance, but whack if necessary."

Next trip down, I'm trail table-side, right next to red-shirt-guy who is standing up. He says, "You should have called that." I turned and said, "You're an assitant coach, remember," and he said, "Sheez, why don't you relax?"

Im not sure how long I stared at him before I whacked. I couldn't believe he would really say that.

Now my question. Could I have done anything differently?

PS when I reported T, I said, "Technical foul on the home assistant coach." He yelled (from the stands), "I'm NOT the assistant coach!" Bookkeeper looks at me blankly. I say, "Technical foul on that red-shirt-guy for disrespecting an official." Bookkeeper smirks, HC groans and rolls eyes. I hurry to the endline/baseline to adminster the shots.
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Old Tue Jan 27, 2009, 01:23pm
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1. T on "bench personnel" works for everyone there and you don't have to listen to him telling you he's the varsity or head coach. 2. Since he told you he knew the rules - no more warnings - WHACK the next time and when he questions it your answer is simply that he told you he knew the rules. 3. I think you let this go too long to begin with - perhaps you should not have "ignored" so long. I think that gets us into trouble sometimes. I have been guilty of doing this myself.
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Old Tue Jan 27, 2009, 01:29pm
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Sounds good to me. The only thing I would've done differently:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juulie Downs View Post
I said to my partner, "What about this guy?" Partner said, "Well, we'll give one more warning if we get the chance, but whack if necessary."
You'd already given him a warning. He's the V coach. He knows the role of assistants, whether they are his during the V game, or if he is acting as one for the sub-V. The longer you let him (or any coach at any level) get away with stuff, the more they own you...
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Old Tue Jan 27, 2009, 01:36pm
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Juulie,

Way too long of an explanation to the "red-shirt guy"...IMO.

He might have felt like he was getting preached to or had an official with a condescending attitude...I don't know.

All he needed was a quick one liner...something like...

"HC lost standing privledges...no standing now"

or

"One HC per game...and he's seatbelted...no standing" (add a please if you want)

...also, I don't make a big deal out of it...just say it in passing. If he doesn't get the hint...then take care of business.
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Old Tue Jan 27, 2009, 01:49pm
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Julie, couple of comments here,
one the head coach got whacked right, was he sitting?
So if the head coach was down from the T and still on the bench why were you having conversations with this guy?

As soon as he is up not coaching I am going to have a word with the head coach and cut this guy off, since we have had one T on the bench already there is little tollerance for any more shenaniggans on this bench.

No matter who he says he is - he is as you so elloqently put it an assistant during this game and therefore not entitled to be up and expressing his personal feelings about what is happening.

I tend to agree you may have let this go on too long.
NIP IT IN THE BUD.
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Old Tue Jan 27, 2009, 02:17pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Juulie Downs View Post
Now my question. Could I have done anything differently?
One sentence, directed at the seated head coach: "Coach, since you had the technical foul, no one is allowed to stand and coach for the rest of the game."

If this fails to get the point across, whack early and often.
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Old Tue Jan 27, 2009, 02:24pm
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Question

Juulie - regarding the title of your thread, isn't the term "Pseudo-Coaches" redundant?
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Old Tue Jan 27, 2009, 02:37pm
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I think her conversation was very professional. I could have been given a little earlier perhaps. Sometime our little comments appear chippy. Her explanation was right on IMHO. Give it a little earlier and thats all the chance he gets.
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Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 01:09am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Juulie Downs View Post
Game last week, see previous thread.

I whacked home HC somewhere into the second quarter. Some guy in a red shirt started pacing around, I figured he's some sort of authority person here, maybe the AD or the Varsity coach. He talked to HC a couple times, when HC needed calming down.

Start of second half, red-shirt-guy was sitting on the bench with players, coaching some, but not a problem in any way. Pretty soon, he started to get up off the bench to coach. Just a little. We ignored it. Pretty soon, he was up off the bench most of the time, coaching, but still not yelling at us. Still he's not the HC, he's been on the bench, and now he was standing and coaching.

So I went over there and quietly and nicely said, "For the purposes of this game, while you're here on the bench and by the bench, you're an assistant coach, and you need to stay seated or leave the bench area." He said, "Oh, I'm not an assistant, I'm the varsity coach." I said, "Okay. You'll be the varsity coach later, but right now, you're an assistant and you need to follow the rules for assistant coaches, which is to stay seated on the bench." He says, "Oh, I know the rules." I said, "Okay great." Behavior didn't change at all.

I said to my partner, "What about this guy?" Partner said, "Well, we'll give one more warning if we get the chance, but whack if necessary."

Next trip down, I'm trail table-side, right next to red-shirt-guy who is standing up. He says, "You should have called that." I turned and said, "You're an assitant coach, remember," and he said, "Sheez, why don't you relax?"

Im not sure how long I stared at him before I whacked. I couldn't believe he would really say that.

Now my question. Could I have done anything differently?

PS when I reported T, I said, "Technical foul on the home assistant coach." He yelled (from the stands), "I'm NOT the assistant coach!" Bookkeeper looks at me blankly. I say, "Technical foul on that red-shirt-guy for disrespecting an official." Bookkeeper smirks, HC groans and rolls eyes. I hurry to the endline/baseline to adminster the shots.
Juulie,

The one thing I would have done differently is talk to the head coach first.

Recently at an eigth grade game, I saw someone standing and coaching the players. He was not the head coach. I went to the head coach and said, "It's my understanding that you are the head coach?" He said, "Yes." I said, "Then who is this person down there?" He kind of shrugged his shoulders. I said, "If he's a coach he needs to be seated. If he's a parent, he needs to be seated with the spectators."

Then if he's still around and standing, I whack the head coach.

Rita
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Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 03:34am
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I remember giving a T to a non-player in a Rec game because he sat with his playing buddies on the bench. T for complaining about the calls or something. Team: "But he isn't a player"
waaaaaaa, cry me a river.
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Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 06:27am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rita C View Post
Juulie,

The one thing I would have done differently is talk to the head coach first.

Recently at an eigth grade game, I saw someone standing and coaching the players. He was not the head coach. I went to the head coach and said, "It's my understanding that you are the head coach?" He said, "Yes." I said, "Then who is this person down there?" He kind of shrugged his shoulders. I said, "If he's a coach he needs to be seated. If he's a parent, he needs to be seated with the spectators."

Then if he's still around and standing, I whack the head coach.

Rita
This is similar to what I do. Usually in passing the bench I'll say - "Only one person has the right to stand and coach."

I've never had to go back and explain it a second time....although, sometimes I wish I was given the opportunity to say just a little bit more!
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Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 04:00pm
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I had a situation similar but with a twist in a JV game. My partner has a call that no one on the visitors side likes. JV Head coach is now hollaring about the call and I come over to see what my partner has. We discuss and decide he needs to report what he had as I can't bail him out of this one. He reports and some guy comes down out of the stands, stands on the sideline area (which is also the walkway) and starts screaming. I ask kindly "Sir, you need to go back in the stands and sit down". His answer is "But I'm the Head Varsity Coach"
My only response "T", now coach you need to calm down or you will not be able to be there for your game. He says, "Technical fouls aren't cumulative from game to game". My answer is "But if you are ejected, you will miss your game too!"

Didn't anyone ever see Shooter walk out onto the court in Hoosiers?

"That's OK, he's an assistant coach"..."T"
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Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 08:47pm
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stmaryram....love the Hoosie/ Shooter..."it's OK he's an assistant"... reference
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Old Thu Jan 29, 2009, 12:44pm
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So if a home Varsity coach from the stands is ejected during a JV game, is he banned from the gym for the night? Or for the remainder of the game?
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Old Thu Jan 29, 2009, 12:50pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bradfordwilkins View Post
So if a home Varsity coach from the stands is ejected during a JV game, is he banned from the gym for the night? Or for the remainder of the game?
Depends on the state. Personally, I rarely deal with fans. Someone in the stands would have to get pretty profane to get my attention, and that includes coaches. (Officials are a different story.)

If, however, you have, for example, the varsity coach sitting as an assistant during the jv game, and he gets himself a couple of Ts, that'll still be up to your state. I wouldn't worry about the next game; the varsity refs will get to deal with him.
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