What Would You Do?

BBall_Junkie · #1 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:07am

Had something happen in a game last night that I have never had happen before and I don't believe will ever happen again...

Midway through the first quarter my partner calls a foul on the visiting team and reports the foul (where I work we still go tableside for HS). As we are about to administer the FT's their is some commotion at the table and the horn buzzes. We hold up the FT's and my partner goes to the table. There is an extended discussion and books are being passed back and forth. I trot over from the C while the lead holds the ball and monitors the players. It turns out that the visiting team manager transcribed a number incorrectly and put 22 in the book (no 22 on the team) instead of 23 who committed the foul.

Visiting coach starts to make excuses, gripe and generally try to whine his way out of an administrative Tech. However, I inform him that it is a rule and he had every opportunity to fix the mistake as he was given the official book to verify and I even pointed out his initialing of the book underneath the last player listed. He shrugs and starts to walk away disgusted.

Meanwhile the home coach (long tenured coach in the area) has used the break to call his team over and have a "free" timeout and is not really paying attn to the table problem. About this time he walks over and I tell him that we are going to let his player shoot the FT's for the foul and then we have a book technical for an incorrect number on V team so he can pick anyone he wants to shoot the T and he will then get the ball back at halfcourt. He then floors me with the following...

"Just forget about all of that and fix the book. It may come back to bite me later, but I am not interested in cheap points. I want to win the game on the merit of my team's play. Let's just play ball."

How would you handle? I will tell you what we did later...

co2ice · #2 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:15am

I would have said, " Coach, get your player over here to shoot the free throws and by the way who would you like to shoot the technical shots??"
If he persisted I would ask "which other rules should we set aside tonight?? I cant believe he actually thought and had the nerve to ask you to do it!

slow whistle · #3 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:17am

"Coach we don't have the option to set that rule aside, we are going to enforce it"

Scrapper1 · #4 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:20am

Coach, if you don't want the points, just have your shooter violate. But we have to award the free throws.

slow whistle · #5 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:22am

Just out of curiosity was this a varsity game? Have had this happen at the lower levels before, but never heard of it at the varsity level...

socalreff · #6 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:23am

Something similar happened in a game last year in NCAA D.1 game.
A technical foul was called on the home mascot. The visiting coach thought it was wrong and instructed his shooter to miss both free throws intentionally.

BBall_Junkie · #7 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:33am

Quote:

Originally Posted by slow whistle

Just out of curiosity was this a varsity game? Have had this happen at the lower levels before, but never heard of it at the varsity level...

Yes...Boys Varsity (biggest high school division in the state)

Rich · #8 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:36am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBall_Junkie

Yes...Boys Varsity (biggest high school division in the state)

The coach doesn't realize it, but he's put the crew in an awkward position, one which will leave nobody happy.

bob jenkins · #9 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:39am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBall_Junkie

It turns out that the visiting team manager transcribed a number incorrectly

The visiting team manager filled out the home / official book?

There's nothing to stop the home team from intentionally missing the T shots and inbounding the ball to the visiting team.

stosh · #10 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 10:56am

I had a JV Boys game with an interesting situation related to this. The scoreboard keeper buzzes me over and tells me that number H23 who I just called a foul on is not in the "book" as 23 but is in there as 5. I go to the home book, and it is apparent that the 5 has been changed from a 5 to a 23, but it is in there as 23. So I tell everyone at the table that we are okay and lets continue. The visiting coach demands (respectfully) an explanation and tells me "his scorekeeper" (who was the one that informed the board operator to buzz me) saw the other scorekeeper change it as I went over. I basically told him that since I didn't see it happen, I had to assume it was changed prior to me signing the book. He wanted to know how come we don't verify each player to the number in the book prior to the game? I told him that it would be too time consuming and that players often perform warm-ups with shooting shirts on so we don't see every number. He gave up and let it go.

Does anyone check numbers on players to match the book before a game?

slow whistle · #11 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 11:36am

Quote:

Originally Posted by stosh

I had a JV Boys game with an interesting situation related to this. The scoreboard keeper buzzes me over and tells me that number H23 who I just called a foul on is not in the "book" as 23 but is in there as 5. I go to the home book, and it is apparent that the 5 has been changed from a 5 to a 23, but it is in there as 23. So I tell everyone at the table that we are okay and lets continue. The visiting coach demands (respectfully) an explanation and tells me "his scorekeeper" (who was the one that informed the board operator to buzz me) saw the other scorekeeper change it as I went over. I basically told him that since I didn't see it happen, I had to assume it was changed prior to me signing the book. He wanted to know how come we don't verify each player to the number in the book prior to the game? I told him that it would be too time consuming and that players often perform warm-ups with shooting shirts on so we don't see every number. He gave up and let it go.

Does anyone check numbers on players to match the book before a game?

I am confused...you called the foul on 23, but there is no 23 or is there? Or are you saying since 2+3=5 you are good to go?

Nobody I know checks numbers to the book, just total number of players...you're right they usually have warmups on and you can't read the numbers anyhow...

deecee · #12 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 12:28pm

When I coached boys freshman my opponent coach was given a horrible T. I simply instructed my player to miss both shots. The parents and team were not happy but I explained to them after the game that honor and dignity in participating in sports matters to me more than winning and losing. Some still didnt get it but oh well.

johnnyrao · #13 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 12:51pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by slow whistle

I am confused...you called the foul on 23, but there is no 23 or is there? Or are you saying since 2+3=5 you are good to go?

Nobody I know checks numbers to the book, just total number of players...you're right they usually have warmups on and you can't read the numbers anyhow...

I think what he is saying is that the visiting book keeper pointed out the error. When the clock operator called the R over the Home book keeper saw what was happening and changed the #, so when the R got to the book it was correct. However, it had been wrong. I know I never check #s against jerseys so I guess I'm fortunate this has never happened to me.

johnnyrao · #14 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 12:53pm

"Coach, I get your intent, but we have no choice on this but to assess the technical foul".

Raymond · #15 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2009, 04:45pm

I assess the 'T' and move on. If you don't assess the 'T' then when that coach makes the same mistake with the book in another game he'll be looking for the 'T' to be overlooked.