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  #16 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 10:35am
Lighten up, Francis.
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sj View Post
Just so I can follow is it a MA policy that the officials stay out on the court and shake hands with all the players and coaches after a game. Unless the school doesn't do certain things. Is that what your referring too.
The teams line up and shake hands and the officials are supposed to stand at midcourt to observe this glorious display of good sportsmanship.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 10:37am
Lighten up, Francis.
 
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Here's a question for the lawyers out there. If the AD does have me blocked from receiving assignments at his school simply because I followed the protocol, is that legal? Is there any recourse for me?
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 10:49am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrapper1 View Post
The teams line up and shake hands and the officials are supposed to stand at midcourt to observe this glorious display of good sportsmanship.
Scheez. I guess that's what the original poster is referring to when he talks about "more" handshake idiocy. Meaning on top of the policy itself he's having to put up with this other protocol stuff. Those guys are sitting ducks standing out there.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 12:54pm
Lighten up, Francis.
 
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Originally Posted by rockyroad View Post
And scrapper, hpw long do you think this idiocy will last?
Sorry, rocky, I read your post yesterday and forgot to respond. The honest answer is that I don't know. I'm hoping that a couple seasons will go by and everyone will see that it's being done sporadically, at best; and that it's not really accomplishing what they thought it would. They'll blame the officials, of course, but maybe it will be enough that either they'll drop it, or it will just die out.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 01:07pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrapper1 View Post
Here's a question for the lawyers out there. If the AD does have me blocked from receiving assignments at his school simply because I followed the protocol, is that legal? Is there any recourse for me?
Do you really WANT to go back there and work knowing the AD is a yutz?
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 01:42pm
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Originally Posted by chartrusepengui View Post
Do you really WANT to go back there and work knowing the AD is a yutz?
That's what I'm thinking...why go back? LOL!

Well, you know what they say 'officials love abuse'.......(just kidding!)
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 01:44pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chartrusepengui View Post
Do you really WANT to go back there and work knowing the AD is a yutz?
If it was me, I would. Mainly because I'd hate being told I couldn't, and I'd hate letting the dictate this. That said, if you go back, you can be sure the AD will do it by the book next time.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 02:01pm
Lighten up, Francis.
 
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Originally Posted by chartrusepengui View Post
Do you really WANT to go back there and work knowing the AD is a yutz?
That's beside the point. The point is whether my rights have been infringed. That's why I asked for a lawyer's opinion.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 02:20pm
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Originally Posted by bigdogrunnin View Post
Gentlemen, I am a school administrator, and I do certainly take offense to both these statements. Don't let a few bad apples dictate your opinion of us all. That is akin to saying that one bad official means we are all horrible. Not true in either case.

I will also add that ANY official that comes to my campus is treated professionally, always. They are provided a safe, clean, and secure area to change and talk. They are provided with drinks (gatorade, water), towels, and showers with hot water. They are also greeted upon entering the facility and escorted onto and off of the floor before, during, and after the game, including an escort to their vehicles upon leaving. No one is allowed to speak with the officials before, during, or after the game. Also officials working at my school don't have to worry about coming to me in regards to fan behavior either, because I am already addressing it. We police the fans to ensure that they are practicing good sportsmanship, no foul-mouthed comments or yelling and screaming at the officials. First time + warning, second time = going home with NO refund. OH, and if we can, we try to have something for the officials to eat or snack on as well.
You are the exception, not the rule. But you knew that.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 09:59pm
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Please ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdogrunnin View Post
I will also add that ANY official that comes to my campus is treated professionally, always. They are provided a safe, clean, and secure area to change and talk. They are provided with drinks (Gatorade, water), towels, and showers with hot water. They are also greeted upon entering the facility and escorted onto and off of the floor before, during, and after the game, including an escort to their vehicles upon leaving. No one is allowed to speak with the officials before, during, or after the game. Also officials working at my school don't have to worry about coming to me in regards to fan behavior either, because I am already addressing it. We police the fans to ensure that they are practicing good sportsmanship, no foul-mouthed comments or yelling and screaming at the officials. First time + warning, second time = going home with NO refund. OH, and if we can, we try to have something for the officials to eat or snack on as well.
Can I work some games at your school. I'll even do junior varsity and/or freshman games.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 10:01pm
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Defenseless, Lame Duck Officials ???

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Originally Posted by Scrapper1 View Post
The teams line up and shake hands and the officials are supposed to stand at midcourt to observe this glorious display of good sportsmanship.
I also believe that their jurisdiction ends with the approval of the final score, thus leaving them defenseless, lame ducks.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 10:16pm
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Here's my report to the MIAA, regarding the game in the original post of this thread:

Quote:
To whom it may concern:

The purpose of this letter is to explain why the officials did not stay to observe the Post-Game Handshake ceremony following the contest between Team A High School and Team B High School on December 20, 2008 and to report the conversation between the Team A High School Athletic Director (name withheld) and me following the contest.

First, the officials did not stay for the PGHS because, in our understanding, the site administration did not fulfill its responsibilities as laid out in the MIAA’s Post-Game Handshake Protocol. According to the Protocol published on the MIAA’s website,

“[t]he site manager will greet the game officials upon their arrival and discuss/plan the post game handshake. Among the most important discussion topics should be the site manager’s or designated person’s (possibly police/security) designated location during the post-game handshake and the plan for exiting the court following the ceremony.”

This meeting and discussion did not happen. I know that Mr. AD believes that it did, but I wish to state as clearly as possible that it simply did not. This can be confirmed by my partner, (name withheld); the JV officials will also confirm that they did not have this meeting and discussion. Upon our arrival, we were met by a gentleman who had us sign a pay voucher. He did not introduce himself as the site manager, nor did he discuss the PGHS ceremony with us. In fact, I had assumed that Mr. AD was the site manager, since he is the Athletic Director and was present at the game. I did not learn until the following night that he was not acting as the site director. Our only interaction with Mr. AD before the game was to shake his hand and basically say “Nice to see you”.

Since we did not have the conversation that seems to be required by the Protocol, even when we saw Mr. AD before the game, we believed that we were not required to stay for the handshake. Additionally, I filed a report with my assignor immediately upon returning home after the game, following the instructions in the “Post-Game Handshake Cancellation – Scenario #3” of the MIAA’s Protocol.

I believe that we acted properly, although it was perceived differently by Mr. AD. If my understanding of the Protocol is incorrect, I am willing to be corrected; but I honestly believe that we did what we were directed to do.

Secondly, following the game, Mr. AD came to the officials’ dressing room to ask why we had not stayed for the handshake. When I explained that I thought we were excused because we had not been met before the game to go over the ceremony, he stated that we had, in fact, been greeted. (In the interest of full disclosure, I also stated that the public announcement about the ceremony had to be made before the start of the game. I was wrong about that, and have since contacted Mr. AD to apologize for that error.) When I tried to explain that the required discussion of the plans for the ceremony had not taken place, he became heated. He called us “ridiculous” and said that “common sense overrules the protocol”.

He then said he was going to report us to the MIAA and let them “deal with us”, and that he was going to tell our assignor to “excuse” us from any further assignments at Team A High School. When I said that it seemed petty to block us simply because we followed the rules, he answered, “I can block anybody for any reason I want to!” At that point, students entered the locker room and Mr. AD left.

I am committed to adhering to the MIAA’s Post-Game Handshake Protocol. I have no problem with following it, unless I am punished for doing so. I do, however, have a problem with a school administrator coming to the officials’ locker room and making threats and attempting to bully the officials. The irony of using such tactics in the effort to improve sportsmanship is absolutely exquisite.

As I’ve said previously, if my understanding of the Protocol is incorrect, I am more than willing to learn from my mistakes.

Last edited by Scrapper1; Mon Dec 22, 2008 at 10:18pm.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 10:28pm
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Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
I also believe that their jurisdiction ends with the approval of the final score, thus leaving them defenseless, lame ducks.
No way I'm approving the score before I leave the court. I want recourse in case someone does or says something stupid.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 10:42pm
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Confirm, Or Not Confirm ???

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Originally Posted by Snaqwells View Post
No way I'm approving the score before I leave the court. I want recourse in case someone does or says something stupid.
I don't think you have a choice in the Bay State. I'm sure Scrapper1 will confirm, or not confirm this aspect for us.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old Mon Dec 22, 2008, 10:43pm
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I think you're right, and it's my 2nd biggest problem with the hand shake garbage.
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