What do you have???

Y2Koach · #1 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 06:01pm

First thing i got is green post player for travelling. Unless it's the summer....

Nevadaref · #2 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 06:06pm

Two points for White and the ball OOB for Green anywhere along the endline.

Why? Do you think that something different should have been called on the play?

mu4scott · #3 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 06:21pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Two points for White and the ball OOB for Green anywhere along the endline.

Why? Do you think that something different should have been called on the play?

So your saying goaltending and a blocking foul on green? Would white get to shoot a free throw as well?

JRutledge · #4 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 06:25pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mu4scott

So your saying goaltending and a blocking foul on green? Would white get to shoot a free throw as well?

Goaltending? No way. The ball was not above the rim. And it looked like the ball was on its way up. Two things you need to have GT were not present.

Peace

mu4scott · #5 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 06:36pm

I didn't think it was goaltending either. That's why I questioned the "two points for green".

eyezen · #6 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 06:58pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mu4scott

I didn't think it was goaltending either. That's why I questioned the "two points for green".

Two points for white is what nevadaref said. And that would be because #30 for white scored.

Adam · #7 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 07:03pm

Looks like a good no-call from the crappy angle we have. Looked to me like the defender flopped; couldn't tell why white stayed down, though.

rockyroad · #8 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 07:15pm

First thing we've got is a Trail official (who becomes the new Lead) standing there and watching all the players take off down the court and then finally decides maybe he should get his a$$ going and thus is in absolutely no position to make any call on this play...luckily for him, I don't really think there was anything to call. There wasn't that much contact and the only reason the white player stayed down is because he hit his elbow on the floor...moral of the story - don't get beat down the floor on plays like this. That was just flat-out laziness.

Nevadaref · #9 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 07:25pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mu4scott

So your saying goaltending and a blocking foul on green? Would white get to shoot a free throw as well?

Nope, that's not what I'm saying.

White make a basket on a follow-up attempt after the blocked shot. That's where the two points come from.

What GT are you talking about?

What blocking foul?

You still haven't stated what YOU believe should have been called on this play. Please be specific.

Scrapper1 · #10 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 07:39pm

Definitely not goaltending, but I think there's probably a blocking foul on the drive. The contact, even if slight, certainly seems to have sent A1 to the floor. Can't tell definitively from the camera angle, but I am leaning more toward the blocking foul than others seem to be.

Nevadaref · #11 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 08:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Definitely not goaltending, but I think there's probably a blocking foul on the drive. The contact, even if slight, certainly seems to have sent A1 to the floor. Can't tell definitively from the camera angle, but I am leaning more toward the blocking foul than others seem to be.

Did the defender obtain his position before the offensive player became airborne?

JRutledge · #12 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 06:07pm

Hard to tell. You might have nothing at all. The camera angle does not help to show if there was any contact or much contact.

Also I would not have a travel without knowledge of what the player is doing with the ball. You are looking at the players back. You must have control to have a travel. It is not about the feet if a player does not have control of the ball. But I would not expect a coach to know that.

Anything that looks funny to them is traveling. The official was looking dead at the play, unlike the video.

Peace

IREFU2 · #13 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 08:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Y2Koach

First thing i got is green post player for travelling. Unless it's the summer....

I agree, a travel on the post player first......and then the second play may have never happened!!!!

mu4scott · #14 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 09:08pm

(NevadaRef... my fault for not being clear about what I was trying to convey. I've always enjoyed your insights on this board. I think I came across a little rude.)

IMHO....

You have to have a whistle on the drive to the basket. From the angle we have it looks like a block to me. I don't see how you can't have a whistle one way or the other on this play.

White gets two free throws and no goaltending IMO.

Nevadaref · #15 (**permalink**) Mon Aug 04, 2008, 10:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mu4scott

(NevadaRef... my fault for not being clear about what I was trying to convey. I've always enjoyed your insights on this board. I think I came across a little rude.)

IMHO....

You have to have a whistle on the drive to the basket. From the angle we have it looks like a block to me. I don't see how you can't have a whistle one way or the other on this play.

White gets two free throws and no goaltending IMO.

Fair enough. I didn't think that you were rude. I just didn't understand what point you were trying to make by posting the video.

In my experience anytime someone posts such a clip that person has a strong opinion about the situation and is looking to share it and get feedback from others.

Therefore, I'll give you my two cents on this play.
1. I believe that the defender established his position on the court prior to the offensive player's second foot leaving the floor (although it is impossible to tell because the official's head obscures the feet of the players). So I believe that he got there in the nick of time. Also, it is my opinion that the defender was not moving towards the opponent and thus did not initiate any of the contact. Therefore, I cannot penalize the defender on this play. I simply can't state anything that he did wrong. So I'm either calling a PC or nothing.

2. Did the amount of contact warrant a PC? Was the defender placed at a clear disadvantage by the contact?
My answers are no to both questions. The attacking player seems to slide to the side and only clip the defender's shoulder and upper body. The defender goes down trying to draw the call. The offensive player gets a bit hurt on his fall because he was at an awkward angle, but he chose to make that move and put himself in that position. I'm not giving him anything that he doesn't deserve just because he stays down.

So my thought is that the official had a poor angle as he got beat in transition, but was fortunate that nothing needed to be called on the play.

In summary even if the action looks very ugly and bodies are on the floor, I have reached a point in my officiating where I can live with no whistle being put on the play, if I truly believe that neither player did anything illegal by rule and that the amount of contact was incidental.