In the huddle

[umpire99]

My partner entered the huddle of one of the teams at the end of the first quarter and yelled at the coaches. They were asking if a buzzer-beating shot had been a two or a three. My partner yelled, "shut up!" to the coaches and then ended up call in "T" while still standing in the huddle. At the half I asked what had been said. He said, "The coach would not shut up and I had the same trouble with him last week." I was always taught to stay away from the huddles. I also was taught to not let something that happened in a previous game carry over to the next one. How could I have helped my partner in this situation?

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by umpire99

My partner entered the huddle of one of the teams at the end of the first quarter and yelled at the coaches. They were asking if a buzzer-beating shot had been a two or a three. My partner yelled, "shut up!" to the coaches and then ended up call in "T" while still standing in the huddle. At the half I asked what had been said. He said, "The coach would not shut up and I had the same trouble with him last week." I was always taught to stay away from the huddles. I also was taught to not let something that happened in a previous game carry over to the next one. How could I have helped my partner in this situation?

It sounds as though the guy needs a serious tutoring on how to handle coaches.

If the guy wants to sink himself, then let him. If you suspect he wants to go and stick his head where it doesn't belong, make up a situation that you want his opinion on - anything to keep him from having an adverse effect on the game. But if he wants to sink himself, there's not much you can do.

[atcref]

forgive my response but you don't have to do anything with this headcase. This guy will fix himself.

[truerookie]

Originally Posted by umpire99

My partner entered the huddle of one of the teams at the end of the first quarter and yelled at the coaches. They were asking if a buzzer-beating shot had been a two or a three. My partner yelled, "shut up!" to the coaches and then ended up call in "T" while still standing in the huddle. At the half I asked what had been said. He said, "The coach would not shut up and I had the same trouble with him last week." I was always taught to stay away from the huddles. I also was taught to not let something that happened in a previous game carry over to the next one. How could I have helped my partner in this situation?

This is what I will probably never understand. Taking your personal feeling out on a team of youngsters. Why?

PENALIZING THE KIDS BECAUSE YOU DO NOT LIKE THE COACH.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by truerookie

This is what I will probably never understand. Taking your personal feeling out on a team of youngsters. Why?

PENALIZING THE KIDS BECAUSE YOU DO NOT LIKE THE COACH.

This is where I have to throw in my who cares about the kids -- its stopped mattering about them once they started playing organized sports. Dont lose sleep over these penalized kids, they will be fine -- unfortunatley rogue officials are out there and I hear Jerry Bruckheimer is going to make a movie about them. It will feature a great scene with Jon Diebler in the State finals officiating, coaching and playing. Should be good...

[inigo montoya]

Originally Posted by deecee

This is where I have to throw in my who cares about the kids -- its stopped mattering about them once they started playing organized sports. Dont lose sleep over these penalized kids, they will be fine -- unfortunatley rogue officials are out there and I hear Jerry Bruckheimer is going to make a movie about them. It will feature a great scene with Jon Diebler in the State finals officiating, coaching and playing. Should be good...

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by umpire99

My partner yelled, "shut up!" to the coaches and then ended up call in "T" while still standing in the huddle.

1) Other than going "near" a huddle to tell a coach how many time outs he has left, I rarely go there. Just asking for trouble......

2) It seems like your partner found it. As we have discussed before "shut up" really has no place in a refs vocabulary. In this case it almost appears provocative. I mean, if a coach says "shut up" to a ref it's probably an automatic "T." So, why should we get away with it?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by grunewar

1) Other than going "near" a huddle to tell a coach how many time outs he has left, I rarely go there. Just asking for trouble

I only go near a huddle to tell the coach that he has used up all of his time outs.

[truerookie]

Originally Posted by deecee

This is where I have to throw in my who cares about the kids -- its stopped mattering about them once they started playing organized sports. Dont lose sleep over these penalized kids, they will be fine -- unfortunatley rogue officials are out there and I hear Jerry Bruckheimer is going to make a movie about them. It will feature a great scene with Jon Diebler in the State finals officiating, coaching and playing. Should be good...

JMO, you have clearly identified yourself as an officials who hold grudges against coaches.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I only go near a huddle to tell the coach that he has used up all of his time outs.

Interesting. Near the end of the game, especially a close one, I let them know how many they have left.....maybe I'm just a nice guy!

[ace]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Interesting. Near the end of the game, especially a close one, I let them know how many they have left.....maybe I'm just a nice guy!

Thats what they have assistants for.

I check for my own personal curiosity and to let the crew be aware - but I never go tell a coach how many he's got left. what if your wrong, grant one to him only to find out the table was wrong when you checked.. and he really had none. You gave him bad information, so do you stick him? No, then how do you deal with the other coach?

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by ace

Thats what they have assistants for.

I check for my own personal curiosity and to let the crew be aware - but I never go tell a coach how many he's got left. what if your wrong, grant one to him only to find out the table was wrong when you checked.. and he really had none. You gave him bad information, so do you stick him? No, then how do you deal with the other coach?

Ace - with all due respect, many of the leagues I ref in, coaches don't have asst coaches or keep their own books. And yes, if I give them them the info from the one and only official book at the table - and they violate it - I stickem..... and it's never happened yet.

Maybe when I hit the "big time" of score keepers that pay close attention, clock operators that are on the ball, books that are always right, multiple books, several asst coaches, etc., I'll be able to change my ways....and I will keep this post in mind in the future.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ace

I check for my own personal curiosity and to let the crew be aware - but I never go tell a coach how many he's got left. What if your wrong, grant one to him only to find out the table was wrong when you checked.. and he really had none. You gave him bad information, so do you stick him? No, then how do you deal with the other coach?

I don't do even that. Near the end of the game I will remind the table to let me , or my partner when either team has used their last time out (so that we can inform the coach).

[ace]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Ace - with all due respect, many of the leagues I ref in, coaches don't have asst coaches or keep their own books. And yes, if I give them them the info from the one and only official book at the table - and they violate it - I stickem..... and it's never happened yet.

Maybe when I hit the "big time" of score keepers that pay close attention, clock operators that are on the ball, books that are always right, multiple books, several asst coaches, etc., I'll be able to change my ways....and I will keep this post in mind in the future.

So if the table tells you he has 1 left, and then you tell him he has 1 left, but when you go to report his supposedly last timeout the table says "we forgot to mark that last timeout, so he really had none" now what are you going to do?

believe me, I'm not at the "big time" of anything. But at the HS varsity level, there are still mistakes at the table, and COs and BKs that make mistakes. Thats where you can really shine as a good official, when you can be on top of that to make sure the game still runs smoothly. And even when you have more than 1 book at the table, theres only 1 that matters, the home book.

Its all part of game management.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by ace

So if the table tells you he has 1 left, and then you tell him he has 1 left, but when you go to report his supposedly last timeout the table says "we forgot to mark that last timeout, so he really had none" now what are you going to do?

While I understand what your saying, to me, where I ref, it doesn't hold water. If the one and only book in the gym says he has one time out left, and I relay that to him, and he calls it - its his. How and when would the scorer say oops later on? Based on what? He has what he has. They'res nothing to compare it against. This is rec and fresh volunteers and parents who do the best they can - these are not trained folks. If it comes up, I guess I'll see how I handle it. Right now, I'm staying the course.